[00:00:02]
>> ARE WE ON? GREAT. CALLING THIS MEETING TO ORDER,
[1. CALL TO ORDER]
IT IS A SPECIAL MEETING OF THE CITY COMMISSION.MADAM CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
>> THE FIRST ORDER OF BUSINESS IS GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENTS.
[2. GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENTS (Part 1 of 2)]
>> PLEASE, MADAM MAYOR, I HAD A SUGGESTION THAT I HOPE MAKE SENSE TO THE BOARD.
COULD WE NOT HAVE A PUBLIC COMMENT HERE BUT HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT AFTER WE DISCUSS THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT WE'RE MAKING TO THE CHANGES TO THE ORDINANCE? THEY CAN RESPOND TO OUR DISCUSSION ON THE CHANGES TO THE ORDINANCE INSTEAD OF COMMENTING BEFORE ON WHAT THE ORDINANCE WAS THE LAST TIME THEY SAW IT.
THAT WILL CUT DOWN, I WOULD THINK, ON HOW MANY PEOPLE WOULD WANT TO COMMENT.
>> WELL, I THINK WHAT I LIKE TO SEE IS AT LEAST A DISCUSSION AND PRESENTATION OF THE ORDINANCE ITSELF.
>> BECAUSE I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF [OVERLAPPING].
>> OH, YES, ABSOLUTELY. I'D SAY WE DO THREE AND FOUR AND THEN WE DO GENERAL COMMENTS.
>> WELL, AND THEN [OVERLAPPING] HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC BEFORE WE DISCUSS, AT LEAST ONCE.
>> I'M NOT SURE I'M COMFORTABLE WITH THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE A PUBLISHED AGENDA AND WE HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE HERE WHO WANT TO SPEAK.
WHAT I WOULD SUGGEST IS TO MAKE SURE THAT MAYBE JUST TO CLARIFY WHAT THE ORDINANCE ACTUALLY SAYS BECAUSE THERE'S MISINFORMATION OUT THERE THAT WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE THE BARS AT MIDNIGHT, WHICH IS NOT WHAT THE ORDINANCE SAYS.
I WANT TO ADDRESS THAT BUT IN TERMS OF THE PUBLISHED AGENDA AND HOW WE WOULD DISCUSS AND THEN HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT AND THEN COME BACK TO DISCUSSION, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE ORDER WOULD BE.
>> MAYBE WE ASK OUR ATTORNEY, IS THERE ANY PROBLEM CHANGING THEIR AGENDA FIRST?
>> YOU CAN CERTAINLY REORGANIZE AN AGENDA AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING, THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM.
YOU ARE LEGALLY REQUIRED TO HEAR PUBLIC COMMENT BEFORE YOU MAKE A DECISION AND I THINK TODAY WAS INTENDED TO BE A WORKSHOP.
I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S A SET ORDINANCE.
THERE'S THE OLD ORDINANCE AND I THINK THAT WAS THE JUMPING-OFF POINT OF GETTING FEEDBACK FROM THE COMMUNITY AND FROM YOU FOR US TO REDRAFT, I ASSUME.
>> WHICH IS WHAT WE GOT AT THE LAST MEETING.
WE GOT THEIR FEEDBACK [NOISE] AND THEN WE HAVE MADE SOME CHANGES TO THE ORDINANCE THAT ARE GOING TO BE PROPOSED HERE TODAY FOR THE WORKSHOP.
MY THINKING WAS, WE HEAR THE PROPOSED CHANGES, WE GET THE PRESENTATION BY AMY SKINNER AND THEN WE GET THE PROPOSED CHANGES, AND THEN WE HEAR PUBLIC COMMENT AND THEN WE COME BACK AND DISCUSS AND MAKE A DECISION.
>> THERE MIGHT BE SOME PEOPLE HERE THAT HAVE TO GO TO WORK AND THEY MIGHT WANT TO MAKE COMMENTS SO THAT THEY CAN LEAVE.
IF THAT'S THE CASE, WE SHOULD PROBABLY LET THOSE INDIVIDUALS SPEAK BECAUSE THEY PROBABLY JUST CAME TO MAKE THEIR COMMENTS AND THEN TAKE OFF.
BUT IF THAT'S NOT AN ISSUE FOR ANYONE THEN I SAY WE CHANGE IT.
>> IF PEOPLE, WHEN THEY TURN THEIR CARDS IN WOULD THEY PLEASE INDICATE IF THEY HAVE TO LEAVE EARLY AND THEN WE'LL PRIORITIZE THEM.
WE'LL GO AHEAD AND MOVE ONTO [OVERLAPPING].
>> OH, YOU DON'T HAVE TO REORGANIZE YOUR AGENDA.
IF YOU'VE DECIDED YOU WERE HEARING MS. SKINNER'S PRESENTATION FIRST FOLLOWED BY PUBLIC COMMENT SO MOVE IT BY SOMEONE ON THE BOARD AND GET A SECOND TENANT VOICE VOTE.
>> ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE.
>> MOTION CARRIES. THE ORDER WILL BE 3 WILL BECOME 2, 4 WILL BECOME 3, AND 2 WILL BECOME 4.
>> AND WE WILL RETURN TO DISCUSSION AFTER 4. [OVERLAPPING]
>> DISCUSSION AND 6 WILL BE ADJOURN.
[3. PROPOSED NIGHTLIFE ORDINANCE]
[00:05:04]
MS. SKINNER, YOU ARE WELCOME TO PRESENT.>> I WANT TO THANK EVERYONE FOR BEING HERE AND PARTICIPATING IN THIS SPECIAL MEETING.
MY NAME IS AMY SKINNER, I'M THE DIRECTOR OF THE PLANNING AND BUILDING DEPARTMENT.
VERY QUICKLY AND JUST A HOUSEKEEPING MATTER, THERE ARE SEVERAL MAPS THAT ARE THROUGHOUT THE ROOM.
I KNOW THEY AREN'T VERY LARGE SCALE SO MAYBE DIFFICULT TO SEE.
IT'S THE SAME MAP THAT YOU RECEIVED IN YOUR PACKET.
BUT I DIDN'T WANT PEOPLE TO KNOW THAT WE DO HAVE AN INTERACTIVE MAP THAT WE MAY BE GOING THROUGH THAT WE COULD GO INTO MORE DETAIL.
THE SCALE OF THAT MAP JUST SHOWS THE DISTRIBUTION OF THE ALCOHOL LICENSES THROUGHOUT THE CITY SO I WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT.
I'D ALSO LIKE TO NOTE THAT THE INSET IS KIND OF A HOT HEAT MAP WHERE IT SHOWS SOME OF THE POLICE CALLINGS LOCATIONS AND THINGS AND, AGAIN, THAT IS IN YOUR PACKET AS WELL.
BUT THERE ARE SEVERAL MAPS IN THE ROOM FOR THE PUBLIC TO LOOK AT.
I DO HAVE BARRY FOX HERE, WHO IS THE CURRENT CODE ENFORCEMENT MANAGER AND SHORT-TERM RENTAL MANAGER FOR OUR DEPARTMENT.
HE WAS THE POLICE CHIEF AT THE TIME THE DISCUSSION STARTED RELATED TO THIS ISSUE SO HE'S AVAILABLE FOR QUESTIONS.
TODD GRANT, OUR PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR, IS ALSO HERE.
HE CAN HELP US GO THROUGH THIS INTERACTIVE MAP AS WE WORK THROUGH THIS SPECIAL MEETING AND HE IS ALSO OBVIOUSLY VERY AWARE OF THE IMPACT ON PUBLIC WORKS AND UTILITIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT SO IF WE HAVE QUESTIONS HE IS ALSO AVAILABLE.
I DO WANT TO WALK THROUGH THE PACKET INFORMATION QUICKLY, JUST A BRIEF HISTORY.
THE CITY EXTENDED THE ALLOWABLE HOURS FOR ALCOHOL SALES WHEN THE CITY OF JACKSONVILLE HAD THE SUPER BOWL IN 2005.
THE EXTRA HOUR THAT WAS ADDED WAS NEVER ROLLED BACK AFTER 2005 SO THE 2:00 AM, IT HAS BEEN IN EFFECT SINCE 2005.
THE DISCUSSION REGARDING THIS ISSUE BEGAN IN 2019 PRIOR TO COVID.
BY 2020 THERE HAD ALSO BEEN SEVERAL INCIDENTS OF VIOLENCE IN AND AROUND THE DOWNTOWN AREA THAT WERE OF CONCERN AND BROUGHT TO QUESTION WHETHER THE CONSUMPTION OF ALCOHOL LATE AT NIGHT CONTRIBUTED OR COULD CONTRIBUTE TO THESE TYPES OF ISSUES AND THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR THOSE LIVING AND WORKING IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA.
THIS ORDINANCE WAS ORIGINALLY DEVELOPED IN 2021 TO ESTABLISH REGULATIONS AND PROCEDURES TO REQUIRE BUSINESS ESTABLISHMENTS THAT ARE SERVING ALCOHOL TO PARTICIPATE IN CERTAIN PROGRAMS, MEET CERTAIN REQUIREMENTS, AND OBTAIN A PERMIT TO SELL ALCOHOL AFTER 12:00 AM.
AFTER MANY COMMUNITY MEETINGS AND SEVERAL CITY COMMISSION DISCUSSION PRESENTATIONS, AN INITIAL FIRST READING OF THIS ORDINANCE WAS HELD IN AUGUST OF 2021.
IT WAS DETERMINED THAT IT WAS IN THE BEST INTERESTS OF THE CITY TO MAINTAIN AND PRESERVE A HEALTHY, VIBRANT, AND BALANCED ATMOSPHERE WITHIN THE CITY ESPECIALLY BETWEEN THE HOURS OF 12:00 AM AND 2:00 AM.
THIS IS AN INTEREST OF BALANCED RESIDENTIAL USES AND NEIGHBORHOODS AND OTHER SAFETY CONCERNS IN THE CITY.
THE CITY ALSO DETERMINED THAT THERE HAD BEEN A NOTICEABLE INCREASE IN COSTS TO SERVICES SUCH AS POLICE RESPONSE AND MAINTAINING SANITARY CONDITIONS BECAUSE OF THE SALE AND CONSUMPTION OF ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES.
THE CITY ENGAGED A FIRM, RESPONSIBLE HOSPITALITY INSTITUTE OR RHI, TO LOOK AT THE SITUATION AND CONDITION ESPECIALLY IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA AND DEVELOP RECOMMENDATIONS BASED ON COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
AFTER FURTHER CONSIDERATION THE CITY DID REVISE THE ORDINANCE THAT WAS ORIGINALLY PROPOSED ELIMINATING SOME REGULATIONS THAT SEEMS BEYOND THE CITY'S OBJECTIVES AND PURVIEW AND DECIDED TO FOCUS MORE ON SETTING PROTOCOLS FOR ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE ESTABLISHMENTS AND THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A REQUIRED EXTENDED HOURS OF OPERATION PERMIT OR EHOPS FOR THOSE ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE ESTABLISHMENTS CHOOSING TO OPERATE AND SELL ALCOHOL FOR CONSUMPTION AFTER MIDNIGHT AND BETWEEN MIDNIGHT AND 2:00 AM.
SIXTEEN OTHER JURISDICTIONS THAT WE KNOW OF ARE
[00:10:02]
IMPLEMENTING OR CONSIDERING SIMILAR ORDINANCES IN FLORIDA.I HAVE A LIST HERE JUST SO PEOPLE CAN LOOK AT.
THIS IS THE LIST OF JURISDICTIONS THAT WE KNOW OF, ST. PETERSBURG, COCONUT CREEK, IT'S A VARIETY OF JURISDICTIONS ACROSS FLORIDA.
MELBOURNE IS CURRENTLY WORKING ON AN ORDINANCE RIGHT NOW, JACKSONVILLE BEACH, FORT LAUDERDALE, ORLANDO.
YOU CAN SEE KIND OF A RANGE OF JURISDICTIONS.
THE CITY HAS ALSO CONSIDERED OTHER IMPACTS SUCH AS POLICE AND REPORT CALLS AND REPORTING.
WE HAVE SOME DATA RELATED TO THAT AND I ESPECIALLY LIKE TO CLARIFY.
IT'S A LITTLE WONKY. THE FOLLOWING DATA WE DID LOOK AT, WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT CHIEF MISHO REALLY WAS HELPFUL IN GETTING THIS DATA ALONG WITH HER STAFF.
BASICALLY, WE LOOKED AT A TWO-YEAR PERIOD BETWEEN AUGUST OF 2021 AND AUGUST OF 2023, DURING THE HOURS OF 12:00 AM TO 02:30 AM WITHIN THE DOWNTOWN AREA OF THE CITY.
THERE WERE OVER 1,400 CALLS DISTRIBUTED ACROSS 61 GENERAL LOCATIONS.
THE MAP ILLUSTRATES THE CALL LOCATIONS, I HAVE THIS MAP.
THE GENERAL LOCATIONS WITH THE HIGHEST NUMBER OF CALLS FOR THIS TIME FRAME ARE THE AREAS, AND THESE ARE CROSS STREETS, WHICH CAN BE A LITTLE CONFUSING BECAUSE THAT'S HOW THE CALLS ARE CALLED OUT FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.
FORT ALLEY, CUNA STREET, HYPOLITA, THESE ARE THE SEVEN LOCATIONS WITH THE HIGHEST NUMBER OF CALLS.
THIS IS THE MAP THAT I'M REFERRING TO.
IT'S BASICALLY BETWEEN THE PARKING GARAGE, WEST CASTILLO, AND THE PLAZA.
OVER THE 1,400 CALLS OCCURRED IN THIS AREA DURING THE TIME FRAME.
ADDITIONALLY, THERE WERE OVER 1,400 CALLS.
OF THOSE 1,400 IN THE SAME AREA.
51 WERE DIFFERENT TYPES OF CALLS.
THE TOP SEVEN CALLS RELATED TO SUSPICIOUS PERSONS, TRAFFIC STOPS, DISTURBANCES, ASSISTING A CITIZEN, BUSINESS ALARMS, SOUND COMPLAINTS, AND SUSPICIOUS CIRCUMSTANCES IN THE DOWNTOWN.
AGAIN, ALL OF THESE CALLS WERE CONSOLIDATED INTO THIS AREA.
THIS IS WHAT WE CALL A KIND OF HOTSPOT MAP.
THIS I THINK IN GIS TERMS, IT'S A LITTLE MORE CONCENTRATED, BUT BASICALLY, THIS SHOWS THE AREAS WITH THE SEVEN HIGHEST AMOUNTS OF CALLS WITHIN THE CITY.
THESE ARE THE CALLS THAT CAME IN BETWEEN THE HOURS OF MIDNIGHT AND 02:30 IN THE MORNING?
>> THAT'S CORRECT. IT'S ONLY FOR A TWO-YEAR PERIOD BETWEEN AUGUST OF 2021 AND '23 AND THEN THE HOURS OF 12:00 AM, AND 02:30 IN THE MORNING.
THIS IS A MAP AND I APOLOGIZE, IT'S AWKWARD.
WE WERE WORKING WITH THE POLICE DATA THAT WE COULD GET WITH THE DIFFERENT SYSTEMS. THIS ACTUALLY SHOWS THE DISTRIBUTION OF CALLS ACROSS THE CITY WITHIN THE SAME TIME PERIOD.
AGAIN, IT'S A TWO-YEAR TIME PERIOD.
THE HOURS OF 12:00 AM TO 02:30.
THERE WERE 5,800 TOTAL CALLS FOR THE POLICE DURING THE SAME TIME FRAMES.
[00:15:05]
THE 1,400 CALLS REPRESENTED 25% OF THE 5,800 TOTAL CALLS IN THE CITY FOR THESE TIME PERIODS.THE POLICE CALL MAPPED, WHERE IT INCLUDES BASICALLY 5% OF THE LAND AREA OR LESS, HAD 25% OF THE POLICE CALLS DURING THAT SAME TIME PERIOD.
THIS MAP HERE, REPRESENTS 25% OF THE TOTAL CALLS FOR THE CITY DURING THAT TIME PERIOD.
THIS IS ACTUALLY LESS THAN 5% OF THE TOTAL LAND AREA OF THE CITY.
THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS IN TOTAL ARE 5% OF THE LAND AREA.
THERE ARE ALSO OTHER TYPES OF IMPACTS AND COSTS THAT THE CITY INCURS SUCH AS SOLID WASTE, WEAR AND TEAR ON THE VISITOR INFORMATION CENTER, THE PARKING GARAGE, PUBLIC RESTROOMS, GENERAL MAINTENANCE, AND WHERE OTHER WEAR AND TEAR ISSUES ON THE CITY'S RIGHTS-OF-WAY AND INFRASTRUCTURE.
THE CITY TAXPAYERS, INCLUDING RESIDENTS AND ALL BUSINESSES, BEAR THE COST OF THE IMPACTS OF THE NUMBERS OF PEOPLE THAT ARE ATTRACTED TO OUR SMALL CITY.
BEBR, WHICH IS THE BUREAU OF ECONOMIC AND BUSINESS RESEARCH AT THE UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA, ARE PROJECTING POPULATION INCREASES OF SEVEN AND A HALF PERCENT FOR THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE.
WE NORMALLY USE 5% AS A PROJECTION.
THEY'RE ACTUALLY INCREASING A HIGHER POPULATION INCREASE OVER THE NEXT YEARS, CREATING THE POTENTIAL FOR MORE CONFLICT BETWEEN RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL USES, ESPECIALLY IN OUR MIXED-USE AREAS.
THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE ALSO INDICATES THAT THE FORT CONTINUES TO ATTRACT APPROXIMATELY 800,000 VISITORS PER YEAR, OR AN AVERAGE OF 67,000 PEOPLE PER MONTH, OR CLOSE TO 2,200 PEOPLE PER DAY, WHICH EQUALS BASICALLY 15% OF THE CITY'S TOTAL POPULATION EVERY DAY IS VISITING THE FORT.
I FIND IT EASIER TO LOOK AT THE HEATMAP, WHICH IS MAP 3 THAN THAT MAP.
>> MAYBE IF YOU TURN IT SIDEWAYS WILL HELP YOU TO GET A BETTER PICTURE.
>> THERE YOU GO. THEN PULL IT DOWN JUST SLIGHTLY. THANK YOU.
>> FOR PEOPLE'S ORIENTATION, THIS IS ACTUALLY ORANGE STREET AND THIS IS BRIDGE STREET.
THIS IS BASICALLY THE CORE AREA OF DOWNTOWN.
THESE HEAT AREAS ARE THE LOCATIONS OF THE SEVEN HIGHEST NUMBER OF CALLS AND HOW THEY CONSOLIDATED ONTO A MAP.
AGAIN, THE CALLS ARE BETWEEN CERTAIN ROADS.
WE DON'T KNOW THE EXACT LOCATION OF THESE CALLS, BUT THEY'RE CONSOLIDATED TO THESE AREAS.
SOME OF THESE CALLS, I BELIEVE ARE PROBABLY ON THE BAY FRONT.
BUT THE WAY THE MAPPING WORK, THEY GOT CONSOLIDATED ONTO CHARLOTTE STREET.
THIS IS TREASURY, THIS IS HYPOLITA STREET RIGHT HERE.
>> TO BE PERFECTLY CLEAR AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS FIGURE, THE CAPTION OR THE TITLE OF THE FIGURE IS RETAIL ALCOHOL BEVERAGE LICENSES IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA.
BUT WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS BOTH THAT IN THE SMALL CIRCLES WITH DIFFERENT COLORS AND SUPERIMPOSED ON TOP OF THAT IS THE HEAT MAP SHOWING WHERE POLICE CALLS ARE?
>> THAT'S OKAY. I WANTED YOU TO BE REALLY CLEAR ON THAT.
>> WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. THANK YOU.
THE SMALLER DOTS ARE THE LOCATIONS OF THE LICENSES.
AGAIN, IT'S DURING THAT SAME TWO-YEAR TIME-FRAME FROM MIDNIGHT TO 02:30 IN THE MORNING.
>> IF YOU DON'T MIND, COULD YOU CALL OUT THE NUMBERS AND POINT TO THEM FOR US BECAUSE IT'S REALLY HARD TO SEE, I THINK.
>> ONE THING I WOULD ASK TO THE LICENSES THAT ARE REFERENCED ON THE MAP, ARE THOSE ALL LICENSES?
[00:20:03]
>> THEY ARE LICENSES RELATED TO ALCOHOL.
>> ALCOHOL, BUT NOT THE ONES THAT ARE OPEN 12:00-02:00?
THEY ARE FOR THE CONSUMPTION ON THE PREMISES AND ON SALES.
THEY'RE NOT TO BE PACKAGE STORE-TIGHT LICENSES OR THE RETAIL LICENSES, BUT THESE ARE ALL LICENSES.
THE INTERACTIVE MAP, I BELIEVE WE CAN GO THROUGH HAS SOME HOURS OF OPERATION.
BUT THESE ARE JUST REPRESENTING THE LOCATIONS THAT HAVE LICENSES.
NOT ANY INDICATION OF WHAT THEIR HOURS ARE OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
>> BUT THE NUMBERS ARE ABOUT TO READ OUR FOUR CALLS BETWEEN 12:00 AM.
>> WE'LL START IN THE NORTH AT ORANGE STREET.
>> OH, EXCUSE ME, 139, 206 CALLS, 79 CALLS, 80 CALLS.
I BELIEVE SOME OF THESE ARE PROBABLY ON THE BAY FRONT ON AVANADE AND MENENDEZ.
[BACKGROUND] JUST FOR CONVERSATION, I DO HAVE SOME TOURISM NUMBERS.
IN OUR EXISTING COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WE DISCUSSED CERTAIN NUMBERS THAT PEOPLE REFERRED TO AS THE SIX MILLION VISITORS.
BUT IN 2021, IT IS REPORTED THAT WE HAD ABOUT THREE MILLION VISITORS.
I LOOKED AT DIFFERENT JURISDICTIONS.
THE CITY'S POPULATION IN 2021 WAS INDICATED AS OVER 14,000 PEOPLE, THREE MILLION VISITORS, OUR MEDIAN INCOME, AND THIS IS BASICALLY ABOUT 20,000 VISITORS PER PERSON IF YOU LOOK AT THE RATIO BETWEEN THE VISITORS AND THE POPULATION, THAT IS FOR DAY TRIPPERS AND THOSE THAT ALSO SPEND THE NIGHT.
JACKSONVILLE BEACH HAS A LOT MORE DAY TRIPPERS AS FAR AS THEIR BEACH IS CONCERNED.
COCOA BEACH, THEY HAVE A SIMILAR POPULATION, SIMILAR NUMBERS.
MELBOURNE, THEY'RE ACTUALLY WORKING ON A SIMILAR ORDINANCE.
THEY'RE SIGNIFICANTLY LARGER, THEY HAVE 85,000 PEOPLE SO THEIR VISITORS PER PERSON IS MUCH LOWER.
FORT LAUDERDALE, AGAIN, THEY HAVE A SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAN WE DO.
MIAMI BEACH HAS A LOT OF VISITORS.
BUT YOU CAN SEE THAT ACTUALLY, I HIGHLIGHTED SOME NUMBERS WHERE WE'RE RIGHT IN THERE WITH A LOT OF VISITORS PER PERSON.
THE CITY'S VISION WAS RATIFIED IN 2014 AND THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN BASED ON THIS VISION WAS ADOPTED IN 2020.
BOTH DOCUMENTS ATTEMPT TO ESTABLISH A DIRECTION TO BALANCE QUALITY OF LIFE, LIVEABILITY, AUTHENTICITY, AND VITALITY, RECOGNIZING THAT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IS IMPORTANT.
THE LAND USE PLAN PROVIDES FOR A PERSPECTIVE ON LAND USE OF THE CITY, FOCUSING ON THE CORE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC AREA, THE HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOODS IN CORRIDORS RADIATING OUT OF THE DOWNTOWN IN THE EVOLUTION OF THE MORE TYPICAL SUBURBAN AREAS ALONG THE MAIN ARTERIOLES THROUGH THE CITY.
I THINK THAT'S WHY I POINTED OUT THE LARGER SCALE MAP WHERE YOU CAN SEE THE CORRIDORS GOING OUT.
WE HAVE A SIGNIFICANT AREA ON ANASTASIA BOULEVARD.
BECAUSE OF ANASTASIA ISLAND IN THE A1A GOING THROUGH THERE, WEST KING STREET IS STARTING TO DEVELOP.
WE HAVE SOME AREAS ON SAN MARCO AS WE GO NORTH FROM THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.
IT IS EXPECTED THAT WITH LIMITED REMAINING VACANT DEVELOPABLE LAND, MOST OF THE NEW DEVELOPMENT IN THE CITY WILL INCLUDE INFILL AND INTENSIFICATION OR REDEVELOPMENT OF EXISTING PROPERTIES WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS.
THE ADOPTED FUTURE LAND USE MAP CONTAINS AND IDENTIFIES APPROPRIATE LOCATIONS FOR
[00:25:02]
EACH LAND USE CATEGORY WHICH ARE ESTABLISHED TO ENCOURAGE PRESERVATION, MOBILITY, AND LIVEABILITY TO PROVIDE FOR THE PROTECTION OF NATURAL AND HISTORIC, AND CULTURAL RESOURCES, AS WELL AS TO BALANCE, AS I SAID, QUALITY OF LIFE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.THAT'S ANOTHER REASON WHY I THINK THAT GENERAL MAP IS IMPORTANT WHEN YOU LOOK AT OUR FUTURE LAND USE MAP, THERE ARE RESIDENTIAL AREAS ADJACENT TO THESE CORRIDORS.
>> COULD WE SAY THAT MAP AGAIN? THE GENERAL MAP THAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT THE CORRIDORS AND SUCH, IF YOU DON'T MIND IF WE SWITCH BACK, COMMISSIONER BLONDER. THANK YOU.
THIS MAY ALSO BE DIFFICULT TO SEE. I'LL DO.
THIS IS THE MAP THAT IS DISTRIBUTED THROUGHOUT THE ROOM.
THIS IS THE MAP THAT WAS IN YOUR PACKET.
YOU CAN SEE ANASTASIA BOULEVARD.
THE BLACK WRITING INDICATES WHERE THE ALCOHOL LICENSES ARE.
AGAIN, THESE ARE JUST ALL LICENSES AND DOESN'T INDICATE ANY HOURS OF OPERATION.
THE REASON I POINT THIS OUT IS BECAUSE THERE ARE RESIDENTIAL AREAS THAT ARE ADJACENT TO ALL THESE CORRIDORS.
THIS IS THE CORE DOWNTOWN AREA.
KING STREET AND WEST KING STREET HEADING OUT.
THIS IS TURNING INTO A NEAT LITTLE ECLECTIC BUSINESS AREA THAT WE'RE SEEING UP AND COMING.
AS YOU HEAD NORTH ON SAN MARCO, YOU CAN SEE THE DISTRIBUTION OF LICENSES AMONGST SAN MARCO AND AGAIN, THERE ARE NEIGHBORHOODS.
ALL BACK BEHIND THE COURT, OR THAT'S HOW OUR PLAN IS BASICALLY STRUCTURED.
THE ROLE OF REGULATION IS TO ATTEMPT TO BALANCE NEEDS AND IMPACTS, AND ESTABLISH A LEVEL OF FAIRNESS ACROSS THE CITY AND TO MITIGATE THE IMPACTS OF DOING BUSINESS ACROSS THE JURISDICTION.
LOOKING AT THESE ISSUES, WE LOOK AT WHAT THIS ORDINANCE DOES DO.
AGAIN, AS YOU NOTED EARLIER, THIS IS THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE.
IT DOES ESTABLISH THAT BUSINESSES, ESTABLISHMENTS THAT SELL ALCOHOL, ARE REQUIRED TO OBTAIN A PERMIT TO SELL ALCOHOL AFTER 12:00 AM TO 02:00 AM.
THE PERMIT IS TO SELL ALCOHOL, DOES HAVE CERTAIN CONDITIONS THAT BUSINESSES ARE REQUIRED TO MEET, AND WILL NEED TO BE RENEWED ANNUALLY.
IN ADDITION TO THE CITIES OF FORT LAUDERDALE, ORLANDO, MELBOURNE, JACKSONVILLE BEACH.
AS I NOTED, THERE WERE 12 OTHER JURISDICTIONS IN FLORIDA BESIDES US THAT ARE CONSIDERING OR HAVE ALREADY PASSED SIMILAR ORDINANCES.
THIS ORDINANCE IS AN ATTEMPT, AS I'VE NOTED, TO BALANCE INTERESTS AMONG THE DIFFERENT STAKEHOLDERS WITHIN THE CITY, INCLUDING RESIDENCES, BUSINESSES, AND WORKERS ALIKE.
WE WANT A SAFE AND ACCESSIBLE ENVIRONMENT.
IN OUR OPINION, THE ORDINANCE REQUIREMENTS INCLUDE GENERAL INDUSTRY STANDARDS.
THE ORDINANCE ALSO ESTABLISHES A NOTICE OF VIOLATION, HEARINGS PROCESS, AND PENALTY PROCEDURES REGARDING THE AFTER-HOURS PERMANENT, INCLUDING IT DOES INCLUDE POTENTIALLY HOLDING BUSINESSES RESPONSIBLE FOR NEGATIVE BEHAVIOR OUTSIDE OF THEIR ESTABLISHMENT.
THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE DOES TRY TO ADDRESS FOUR SPECIFIC AREAS OF CONCERN, SOUND, SECURITY, TRAINING, AND INFRASTRUCTURE FATIGUE.
SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO SOUND IT DOES LIMIT AMPLIFIED MUSIC TO INSIDE.
IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE INSIDE AREA, IT DOES SET LIMITATIONS ON EXTERIOR MUSIC WHERE IT'S CERTAIN HOURS ON SUNDAY THROUGH THURSDAY AND FRIDAY AND SATURDAY.
THEN IT ALSO REFERENCES OUR EXISTING WHAT WE CALL NOISE ORDINANCE TO REGULATE SOUND.
FOR SECURITY PURPOSES, WE DO HAVE A PROCESS FOR USE BY EXCEPTION TO ALLOW BARS DOWNTOWN.
SOMETIMES THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD PUTS CONDITIONS
[00:30:02]
SO IT DOES NOTE THAT CONDITIONS WOULD APPLY.NO ALCOHOL SALES DURING MANDATORY EVACUATIONS, AND ESTABLISHES NO ALCOHOL SALES DURING IMPLEMENTED CURFEW HOURS, AND TALKS ABOUT PROVIDING SECURITY WHICH CAN BE IN THE FORM OF HUMANS, OR CAMERAS, DEPENDING ON THE TYPES OF EVENTS THAT WE EXPECT ESTABLISHMENTS TO PROVIDE SECURITY BASED ON THE NATURE OF THEIR EVENT.
TRADE RELATED TO TRAINING ALCOHOL ESTABLISHMENTS MUST ESTABLISH A LAST CALL PROCEDURE.
STAFF IS PROHIBITED, EXCUSE ME, FROM DRINKING OR SHIFT DRINKING WHILE ON DUTY.
THIS IS ONLY RELATED TO BEING ON DUTY AND AT LEAST ONE STAFF MEMBER MUST COMPLETE A RESPONSIBLE BEVERAGE SERVICE TRAINING PROGRAM WITHIN THE PREVIOUS 12 MONTHS.
INFRASTRUCTURE FATIGUE, AND OF COURSE, WE CAN GET INTO SOME DETAILS AND MR. GRANT CAN HELP ME WITH THAT.
BUT WE DO, AS NOTED, WE HAVE A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF TOURISTS THAT COME TO OUR CITY EVERY DAY.
SOMETIMES WHEN I LOOK AT THESE NUMBERS, I THINK, OH MY GOODNESS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ENOUGH CHEWING GUM IN.
SMITH WANTS TO HOLD OUR SYSTEM TOGETHER.
BUT WE DO, WE'RE DEALING WITH TRAFFIC ISSUES, MOBILITY IMPACTS ON THE INFRASTRUCTURE, WATER, SEWER, SOLID WASTE, GENERAL MAINTENANCE.
HISTORIC RESOURCES ARE IMPORTANT IN OUR HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOODS, ARE IMPACTED BY THE VOLUME OF TOURISTS, SINCE THE FIRST READING THAT WE HAD IN JULY, WE HAVE LOOKED AT THE ORDINANCE AGAIN AND WE DO HAVE SEVERAL PROBABLY RECOMMENDATIONS THAT WE HOPE THAT WE HEARD AT THE MEETING AND THAT THE CITY COMMISSION MAY CONSIDER.
WE MAY CONSIDER CHANGING THE SOUND OR NOISE ORDINANCE REFERENCE TO JUST STRICTLY THAT THE EXISTING NOISE ORDINANCE THAT WOULD SIMPLIFY THINGS SO THAT WE KNOW ACROSS THE BOARD WE ALREADY HAVE AN EXISTING NOISE ORDINANCE THAT IS WHAT WILL BE ENFORCED.
>> IT'S REALLY FROM THE RECEIVING PROPERTY, SO DEPENDING ON WHERE THE RECEIVING PROPERTY IS, THAT WOULD BE THE DECIMAL.
WE CAN PULL THAT UP IF YOU'D LIKE TO SEE IT.
THE POLICE DEPARTMENT IS THE AGENCY RESPONSIBLE FOR MEASURING THE NOISE AND THEY MEASURE IT AS MS. LOPEZ NOTED, FROM THE RECEIVING PROPERTY.
WE DO THINK THAT WE PROBABLY DO NEED TO CLARIFY LANGUAGE.
I BELIEVE IT WAS NOT THE INTENT THAT BUSINESSES HAD TO CLOSE AT MIDNIGHT.
IN FACT, WE WOULD PROBABLY ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO CONTINUE SERVING FOOD AFTER MIDNIGHT.
BUT THIS IS JUST A PERMIT THAT DEALS WITH THE SALE OF ALCOHOL BETWEEN 12:00 A.M. AND MIDNIGHT.
I THINK THERE ARE ERRORS AFTER AREAS AFTER LOOKING AT THE ORDINANCE AGAIN, THAT WE COULD PROBABLY CLARIFY THAT BETTER, THAT IT JUST RELATES TO THE SELLING OF ALCOHOL.
WE COULD REVISE AND CLARIFY LANGUAGE SO THAT BUSINESSES ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR BEHAVIOR OUTSIDE OF THEIR ESTABLISHMENT.
THIS TOOK ME A MINUTE TO UNDERSTAND AFTER THE JULY MEETING, AND BECAUSE IT'S NOT IN THE REGULATORY SECTION OF THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE, BUT THERE IS LANGUAGE IN THE ENFORCEMENT SECTION OF THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE THAT DOES DISCUSS THE ESTABLISHMENT RESPONSIBILITIES OF THINGS HAPPENING OUTSIDE OF THEIR BUSINESS.
WE COULD RELOOK AT THAT, WE CAN RELOOK AT THE ENFORCEMENT SECTION IN GENERAL, I THINK.
WE'VE ALSO TALKED ABOUT RECOMMENDING A WAIVER FOR [BACKGROUND] THANK YOU.
WE ALSO HAVE TALKED ABOUT RECOMMENDING A WAIVER TO THESE REQUIREMENTS THREE TIMES A YEAR.
THE IDEAS THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT AT THE STAFF LEVEL OR NEW YEAR'S EVE, ST. PATRICK'S DAY IN FOURTH OF JULY.
WE KNOW THAT THERE ARE SOME PRETTY FUN THINGS THAT HAPPEN ON THOSE NIGHTS AND THAT.
ADDITIONALLY, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT IS SUBMIT SOME REQUESTS RELATED TO DETAILS RELATED TO AN ANNUAL INSPECTION
[00:35:03]
AND CROWD MANAGER TRAINING THAT WE WOULD, LET'S SEE IF WE CAN.THERE ARE CERTAIN TIME-FRAMES FOR CERTAIN LEVELS OF NOISE.
IT RANGES BETWEEN 55 AND 75 DEPENDING, I'M NOT FAMILIAR HOW THAT'S MEASURED.
>> IT'S MEASURED FROM THE COMPLAINANTS PROPERTY LINE, SO YOU HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE ZONING USES FOR THE RECEIVING PROPERTY, THE FOLKS COMPLAINING ABOUT THE NOISE, AND THEN USE THE CHART.
IF THE RECEIVING PROPERTY IS A RESIDENTIAL OR I THINK THERE'S HP ON THERE, THAT IS WHERE YOU TAKE OR THE POLICE OFFICER WOULD TAKE THE DECIBEL READING.
IT'S FROM THE RECEIVING PROPERTY, NOT FROM THE EMINATING PROPERTY, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.
>> WITH THAT, THAT IS ALL I HAVE AS FAR AS WALKING THROUGH THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE AND THE CONDITIONS OF THE CITY.
THANK YOU, AND IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION. YOU MADE A COMMENT ABOUT THEM SERVING FOOD LATER, BUT THE AVERAGE PLACE CANNOT SERVE FOOD LATER BECAUSE THEY HAVE A WAITSTAFF AND THEY NEED TO CLEAN THE KITCHEN SO THEY CAN BE PREPARED FOR THE NEXT DAY.
THEY WOULDN'T GET OUT OF THOSE ESTABLISHMENTS UNTIL 2:00 OR 03:00 IN THE MORNING IF THEY WENT FURTHER INTO THAT, AND THEY'VE GOT TO KEEP THE WAITRESSES ON LONGER AND THE WAITERS THAT'S NOT IN THE ORDINANCES. IS IT?
>> WELL, CERTAINLY EACH INDIVIDUAL ESTABLISHMENT HAS TO DETERMINE HOW THEY WANT TO FUNCTION.
I ONLY JUST COMMENTED RELATED TO WE'RE NOT ASKING BUSINESSES TO CLOSE AT MIDNIGHT NECESSARILY UNLESS THEY CHOOSE TO.
BUT THIS PERMIT THAT WE'RE DISCUSSING IS ONLY RELATED TO THE SALE OF ALCOHOL.
THEY COULD CONTINUE TO OPERATE AND SERVE FOOD AND THINGS.
THEY JUST CAN'T SELL ALCOHOL AFTER MIDNIGHT UNLESS THEY PARTICIPATE WITH THE PERMIT.
>> COULD YOU GIVE ME A LITTLE BIT MORE INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT IS REQUESTING.
I DO KNOW THAT THEIR FIRST RESPONDERS AND THAT THEY GET A LOT OF THESE CALLS.
I THINK I UNDERSTAND THE ANNUAL INSPECTION REQUIREMENTS, BUT THE CROWD MANAGER TRAINING, I NOTICED THAT OTHER CITIES ORDINANCES DO ADDRESS CROWD MANAGER TRAINING IN CASE OF INCIDENTS WHILE THE BARS ARE PACKED AND MAYBE A GUN OR SHOOTING OR SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED IN OTHER CITIES.
BUT COULD YOU HELP ME UNDERSTAND THAT A LITTLE BIT BETTER?
>> THE ABBEY PEN AND GO WITH THE FIRE MARSHAL IS HERE AS WELL.
I'D PROBABLY PREFER THAT SHE ADDRESSED THAT.
IT REFERS TO THE FPA CODE AND THE DIFFERENT OCCUPANCIES RELATED TO ASSEMBLIES.
>> LIKE I SAID, I'VE SEEN THE CROWD MANAGER DESIGNATION BEFORE, BUT I'M JUST CURIOUS.
>> GOOD MORNING. I'M ABBY PADAGO, THE FIRE MARSHAL.
THE FLORIDA FIRE PREVENTION CODE DOES REQUIRE A CERTIFIED CROWD MANAGER FOR ALL ASSEMBLY OCCUPANCIES, WHICH IS AN OCCUPANCY WITH OVER 50 OCCUPANTS WHERE PEOPLE WOULD BE CONGREGATING TO EAT, DRINK, ANY FUNCTION LIKE THAT.
THE ROLE OF THE CROWD MANAGER IS TO BASICALLY KEEP THE PEACE.
IF THERE WAS AN EMERGENCY IN THE BUILDING, THE CROWD MANAGER TRAINING GOES OVER THE SAFETY AND SECURITY HAZARDS THAT COULD OCCUR IN THE BUILDING.
DIFFERENT TECHNIQUES FOR KEEPING PEOPLE CALM AND AN EMERGENCY.
UNDERSTANDING METHODS OF EVACUATION AND MOVEMENT.
THE PROCEDURES FOR REPORTING EMERGENCIES, AND BASICALLY HOW TO FAMILIARIZE THEMSELVES WITH THEIR PARTICULAR VENUE AND WHAT MIGHT OCCUR THERE IF THERE WAS AN AFTER HOURS EMERGENCY. ANY EMERGENCY.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION FROM THE CONSOLE.
>> THIS IS A REQUIREMENT THAT THEY ALREADY HAVE TO FULFILL?
>> IT IS IN THE CODE THAT THIS BE FULFILLED.
IT'S NOT SOMETHING WE'VE REALLY ENFORCED UP UNTIL THIS POINT, EXCEPT FOR BUILDINGS WITH OVER AN OCCUPANT LOAD EXCEEDING 250.
BUT IT IS IN THE CODE FOR ALL OCCUPANCIES WITH 50 OR MORE.
>> IT'S ALREADY REQUIRED OF ALL THE BARS AND RESTAURANTS?
>> TO HAVE A CROWD MANAGER AND TRAINING?
>> THEY HAVE ANNUAL INSPECTIONS?
[00:40:01]
I'VE HAD MORE FUN LOOKING AT DATA.
I LOVE THESE CHARTS AND THE AMOUNT OF DATA YOU ALL PRODUCED AND THE SHORT PERIOD OF TIME WAS REALLY COMMENDABLE, SO THANK YOU TO EVERYBODY THAT DID THAT.
>> YES, OUR RGIS TEAM IS AMAZING.
THEY TOOK SOMETHING AND THEY MADE A VERY SMALL INSTRUCTION AND THEY MADE IT INTO SOMETHING REALLY USEFUL.
I REALLY APPRECIATE ALL THEIR EFFORTS THERE.
>> IS THERE A WAY THAT WE CAN PROJECT WHAT WE HAVE ON OUR SCREENS UP FOR THE PUBLIC TO SEE.
BECAUSE I THINK MR. GRANT'S GOING TO GO OVER THIS.
>> YES, MR. GRANT WILL PUT THIS UP ON THE SCREEN. HERE IT IS.
>> GOOD MORNING, MAYOR, VICE MAYOR, COMMISSIONERS.
TODD GRANT, PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR.
THE MAP THAT'S UP ON THE SCREEN IS SIMILAR TO WHAT MS. SKINNER HAS BEEN SHOWING AS FAR AS PAPER MAPS.
WHAT YOU SEE BEFORE YOU, YOU HAVE ACTUALLY THE BARS LISTED ON THE RIGHT-HAND SIDE OF THE MAP THAT STAY OPEN PAST 12:00 AM, AND WITH THIS, YOU CAN ZOOM INTO THE VARIOUS BAR LOCATIONS.
YOU CAN ALSO SCROLL THROUGH THIS TO SHOW WHICH ONES ARE ACTUALLY OPEN LATER.
THESE ARE THE CONSUMPTION OF ALCOHOL ON-PREMISES.
THE MAP SHOWS THE VARIOUS LOCATIONS FOR BARS AND RESTAURANTS THAT SERVE.
THEN YOU CAN ALSO SEE THE ONES THAT ACTUALLY STAY OPEN CURRENTLY PAST MIDNIGHT.
>> THANK YOU. ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE BUSINESS SERVING ALCOHOL MAPPING?
>> I AGREE THAT THIS IS AN AMAZING AMOUNT OF WORK AND VERY USEFUL, I THINK.
>> I GUESS MY QUESTION WOULD BE, IT LOOKS TO ME LIKE THERE'S A TOTAL OF 188.
THEN IF YOU ZOOM INTO THE AREA THAT WE'VE BEEN LOOKING AT PRIMARILY, HOW WOULD I DETERMINE HOW MANY BUSINESSES SERVING ALCOHOL?
>> WELL, AND TO CLARIFY, THERE ARE ONLY 27 THAT ARE OPEN AFTER MIDNIGHT.
>> THERE'S 27, AND THAT INCLUDES ARNOLD'S ALL THE WAY TO ANASTASIA ISLAND, IT'S NOT JUST THE DOWNTOWN.
>> IF YOU LOOK AT THE CITY AS A WHOLE, THERE'S 188 LICENSE HOLDERS FOR CONSUMPTION OF ALCOHOL ON-PREMISES, AND SO AS COMMISSIONER SPRINGFIELD NOTED, THERE'S 27 BARS OR RESTAURANTS THAT STAY OPEN PAST MIDNIGHT.
AS YOU SCROLL IN, IT'S REDUCING THE NUMBER OF ESTABLISHMENTS BASED ON WHAT'S IN THE MAP AREA.
AGAIN, SO OVERALL, THERE'S 188 THAT HAVE A ALCOHOL LICENSE FOR CONSUMPTION ON-PREMISES.
WHAT'S LISTED ON THE SIDE ARE ONLY THE BARS OR RESTAURANTS THAT ARE OPEN PAST MIDNIGHT, OF WHICH THERE'S ONLY 27.
>> AS I ZOOM IN ON THE MAP, ON THE AREA THAT WE'VE BEEN DISCUSSING, IT SHOWS ME 66 OUT OF 188. IS THAT CORRECT?
>> DEPENDING ON WHERE YOU STOP YOUR ZOOM, YES.
YOU COULD GET DOWN TO BRIDGE STREET WAS WHERE I THINK THE CUTOFF WAS.
>> I WOULD LIKE TO JUST POINT OUT THAT THESE COORDINATES WOULD NOT JUST COVER THESE BARS, IT WOULD COVER ALL THE ONES IN THE CITY.
IT WILL BE ARNOLD'S, AND THOSE IN ANASTASIA ISLAND AS WELL.
THEY'LL BE ALL 27, PLUS ANYONE ELSE THAT OPENS UP LATE FOR A SPECIAL EVENT OR DECIDES TO OPEN UP LATE LATER.
[00:45:03]
>> HOW DO WE TEASE OUT THE 27?
>> IS THERE A WAY TO DO THAT, SO WE CAN GET A LOOK AT THEM? NO LAYER FOR THAT?
>> I CAN'T SEE A LAYER FOR THAT.
>> THAT'S SOMETHING MAYBE WE CAN WORK ON.
>> I CAN GET THEM TO JUST DO THE 20, A&A IT'S GOING TO GO BY LICENSE.
BUT THE CELESTENOS WILL THROW THAT OFF BECAUSE THEY'RE PRIMARILY JUST THE TWO AND FOUR.
I'LL HAVE TO ADJUST THE MAP, AND I CAN SEND THAT OUT VIA A LINK.
>> THANK YOU. WILL WE BE MAKING THIS MAP AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC?
>> IT'S ONLINE, AND HOW DO YOU ACCESS IT ONLINE? DO WE HAVE A PAGE?
>> CORRECT. YOU GO TO THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE GIS PAGE, AND THERE IS SOMETHING CALLED THE DATA HUB.
THEN ONCE YOU GO TO THE DATA HUB, IT HAS VARIOUS MAPS THAT HAVE BEEN CREATED BY GIS.
>> THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, COMMISSIONERS? QUESTIONS TO MS.SKINNER?
>> COMMISSIONERS HOW ARE YOU FEELING NOW?
[4. DISCUSSION AND RECOMMENDATION(S) RELATED TO THE DRAFTED NIGHTLIFE ORDINANCE LANGUAGE AND ACTION MOVING FORWARD]
OUR NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA NOW THAT WE'VE HAD THE PRESENTATION IS DISCUSSION AMONGST US.I GUESS WE COULD BEGIN WITH COMMISSIONER HARRIS.
DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS?
>> WELL, I SEE THE DATA, AND I SEE HOW MANY COMPLAINTS THAT THEY SAID THAT THEY HAD IN A WINDOW OF TIME OF YEARS.
I SEE THAT A LOT OF THOSE CALLS WERE SUSPICIOUS PERSON, THEY WEREN'T ALL FOR ALCOHOL.
IF I LOOK ON MY DOOR AND SEE SOMEBODY LOOKING CRAZY, THEY CALL THE POLICE [OVERLAPPING]
>> PARDON ME, JUST ONE MINUTE.
WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO TODAY IS WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE DOING CLAPPING OUT LOUD.
I JUST WANT TO EXPLAIN THIS, PEOPLE WITH DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES ARE IN THIS ROOM TODAY.
YOU MAY NOT AGREE WITH WHO'S SITTING WITH YOU NEXT TO YOU, AND CLAPPING, SPEAKING OUT LOUD, THAT CAN BE INTIMIDATING TO THOSE THAT ARE ALSO HERE TO SPEAK.
PLEASE BE COURTEOUS TO YOUR NEIGHBORS, AND DO NOT SPEAK OUT LOUD, DO NOT SHOUT OUT LOUD, DO NOT CLAP.
>> THERE WAS A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT THINGS ABOUT WHAT THOSE CALLS CONSISTED OF.
IT'S A SCALE UP AND DOWN AS FAR AS THE ANALYSIS OF THE SITUATION, THERE IS PEOPLE THAT ARE MINDFUL.
I WOULD HOPE THAT ANYBODY THAT DECIDES TO GO INTO A BAR KNOWS THAT LEVEL OF CONSUMPTION WHERE THEY CAN DRINK, ESPECIALLY IF THEY DROVE A VEHICLE THERE.
OUR ORDINANCE OR NOT, IS NOT GOING TO MAKE SOMEBODY BE MORE ACCOUNTABLE.
IT'S UP TO THE INDIVIDUALS THAT PARTAKE IN ANY BUSINESS OR A PLACE.
THAT RESPONSIBILITY REALLY RELIES ON THE PERSON.
I DO HAVE CONCERNS AS FAR AS I WENT TO A RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION.
THE MAIN CONCERNS THAT I HEARD FROM INDIVIDUALS THAT WANTED THIS ORDINANCE TO PASS WAS THE NOISE.
THERE WAS A REAL CONCERN ABOUT THE NOISE.
I THINK EVERYONE SHOULD BE COMFORTABLE IN THEIR HOME THAT I DON'T WANT TO HEAR WHAT'S GOING ON DOWN THE STREET.
MY CONCERN MORE THAN THE DRINKING AND THE BAR, MONITORING THE BAR IS THE NOISE, KEEPING THE NOISE CONTAINED IN YOUR ESTABLISHMENT.
I ALSO FEEL THAT WE HAVE TO BE MINDFUL THAT PEOPLE ARE IN BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY.
I DO BELIEVE I DON'T GO TO ANY ESTABLISHMENT WHEN I DO GO OUT THAT DOESN'T HAVE A LAST CALL AS FAR AS ALCOHOL IS CONCERNED.
FOR WHATEVER REASON, A LOT OF PEOPLE RUN TO GET ANOTHER DRINK, WHETHER THEY NEED ONE OR NOT.
BEING MINDFUL AND TELL THEM THE LAST CALL, THAT'S JUST PROBABLY GOING TO MAKE PEOPLE RACE TO GO GET ANOTHER DRINK BECAUSE THEY MIGHT NOT EVEN BE THINKING ABOUT ANOTHER DRINK UNTIL YOU SAY THAT.
THERE'S AN ENCOURAGEMENT TO GET THAT LAST DRINKING.
[00:50:04]
IT'S REALLY LIKE YOU CAN'T BLAME THE DUIS ON THE BARS BECAUSE PEOPLE DRINK AT HOME.LIKE I SAID BEFORE, PEOPLE DRINK AT HOME, PEOPLE GO TO PARTIES THAT THERE'S SOMEBODY'S HOUSE AND DRINK.
PEOPLE HAVE JOB COMPANY PARTIES AND THEY DRINK THERE.
ALL THESE DUIS AND STUFF LIKE THAT DON'T HAPPEN FROM A BAR.
SOME MIGHT, I WOULD THINK THAT IF YOU OWN THE ESTABLISHMENT AND SOMEBODY IS FALLING AND TRIPPING, THAT IF IT'S A GOOD BAR THAT THEY WOULD CALL A CAB, OR TAKE THEIR KEYS, OR MAKE SURE THAT INDIVIDUAL GOT HOME SAFELY.
THAT'S CALLED LIVING, SLEEPING WELL AT NIGHT, THAT YOU KNOW THAT YOU'VE SAVED A LIFE.
I JUST THINK THAT WE AS A COMMUNITY, NEED TO DO WHAT'S BEST FOR EVERYONE, THE RESIDENTS, THE BUSINESS OWNERS, THE ESTABLISHMENT, OURSELVES, OUR NEIGHBORS, AND MAKING LAWS THAT HELP ONE AND HURT ANOTHER IT'S LIKE A SCALE.
WHAT IS THE RIGHT DECISION? PASSING AN ORDINANCE TO REALLY CONSTRAIN OUR BUSINESS OR NOT PASSING AN ORDINANCE TO UPSET SOMEONE BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT THE BAR TO BE OPEN.
IT'S JUST A MATTER OF USING COMMON SENSE.
AND PEOPLE SAYING THAT ST. AUGUSTINE IS LIKE US, ST. AUGUSTINE IS NOT LIKE US.
ST. AUGUSTINE IS A TOURIST PLACE BECAUSE OF OUR LEGACY OF KNOWLEDGE AND HISTORY.
PEOPLE GO TO DISNEY FOR MICKEY MOUSE.
PEOPLE COME HERE TO SEE THE OLDEST CITY, THE OLDEST JAIL, THE OLDEST RESTAURANTS. THANK YOU.
>> YES. CAN I ASK MS. SKINNER, COULD YOU PUT UP THE RECOMMENDATIONS TO CONSIDER SO EVERYBODY CAN LOOK AT THOSE A LITTLE BIT MORE COMPLETELY.
I WOULD JUST SAY THAT MOST OF OUR ESTABLISHMENTS REGULATE THEMSELVES VERY WELL AND MANY OF THEM HAVE WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR TRAINING, THAT'S JUST BEING A GOOD BUSINESS.
BUT WE DO HAVE A FEW BAD ACTORS AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS PERMIT.
BUT I THINK WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ALL OF THESE ITEMS THAT WE'RE DISCUSSING, THE FIRST ONE, THE NOISE ORDINANCE, SHOULD NOT BE, IN MY OPINION, IN THIS PERMIT.
IT'S ALREADY COVERED UNDER THE NOISE ORDINANCE.
I THINK WE COULD CLARIFY SOME OF THE LANGUAGE, THE FACT THAT YOU CAN'T STAY OPEN UP TO 12 O'CLOCK AND SERVE FOOD, WHICH WE DISCUSSED.
THE THIRD ONE WAS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR BEHAVIOR OUTSIDE OF THE ESTABLISHMENT.
YOU CAN'T CONTROL PEOPLE THAT COME DRUNK TO YOUR DOOR AND CAUSE PROBLEMS. HOPEFULLY THE PEOPLE THAT ARE LETTING THE PEOPLE OUT OF THEIR BAR, HAVE ALREADY REGULATED THEM SO THEY'RE NOT DRUNK WHEN THEY LEAVE.
THEN THE NEXT ONE IS TO RE-LOOK AT THE ENFORCEMENT SECTION OF THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE TO ENSURE THAT THEY ARE NOT OVERLY PUNITIVE, WHICH I THINK THIS ORDINANCE ISN'T.
YOU GET A FIRST WARNING, YOU GET A SECOND WARNING.
IT'S NOT LIKE WE'RE GOING TO TAKE YOUR LICENSE AWAY RIGHT AWAY AND THEN RECOMMEND A WAIVER TO THESE REQUIREMENTS, WHICH ARE THOSE THREE DATES, THAT MIDNIGHT IN ST. PATS AND 4TH OF JULY, PEOPLE MIGHT WANT TO POP A BOTTLE OF CHAMPAGNE.
THEN OF COURSE, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT AND THE CROWN MANAGING TRAINING IS ALREADY IN OUR RULES FROM THE STATE, SO WE SHOULD BE ENFORCING THAT.
WHEN I HEARD IN JULY EVERYBODY SPEAKING, IF WE ENFORCE THESE, I THINK WERE RESPONDING QUITE WELL TO WHAT WE HEARD FROM MOST OF THE PEOPLE THAT SPOKE.
I HOPE THAT WHEN WE OPEN UP BACK UP, THAT EVERYBODY WILL CONSIDER THESE AS THINGS THAT WE COULD DO TO BE MORE COOPERATIVE BETWEEN THE CITY AND ESTABLISHMENTS AND THAT'S REALLY ALL I HAVE TO SAY.
[00:55:02]
>> THANK YOU. I WANT TO CHANGE THE SUBJECT A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE OF THE COMMENTS THAT WERE MADE LAST TIME AND THAT GOES TO THE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT THESE BARS PROVIDE FOR THE CITY.
I DID A LITTLE ANALYSIS OF OUR CURRENT BUDGET.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT OUR BUDGET, 33% OF OUR OVERALL BUDGET COMES FROM TAXES.
BUT SOME OF THAT INCOME COMES FROM WATER AND SERVICES, THE GARBAGE AND STUFF.
BUT IF YOU LOOK AT JUST THE GENERAL FUND WHICH REALLY OPERATES, 56% COMES FROM TAXES.
WHEN YOU SAY THAT, YOU'VE ASSUMED THAT IT'S AD VALOREM TAXES AND THE MAJORITY OF IT IS AD VALOREM, BUT 21% OF THAT IS BUSINESS AD VALOREM TAXES.
THOSE AD VALOREM TAXES WOULD STAY THE SAME IF ALL THE BUSINESSES CLOSED AT 10 O'CLOCK BECAUSE OF THE VALUE OF THE PROPERTY.
THE RESIDENTS AD VALOREM TAXES ARE 18%.
THE SALES TAX THAT WE COLLECT IS 4%.
THAT IS SALES TAX FROM EVERY BUSINESS IN THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE, 24 HOURS A DAY.
THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT WE COLLECT FROM THE 27 BUSINESSES THAT ARE OPEN FROM MIDNIGHT TO TWO WOULD NOT EVEN BE A BLIP ON OUR BUDGET IF THEY CLOSED.
THEY DO NOT PROVIDE ANY ADDITIONAL FUNDS FOR THE CITY BECAUSE THEY'RE OPEN.
I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY THAT THERE IS NOT A WINDFALL FOR THE CITY GOVERNMENT.
YOU CAN MAKE THE ARGUMENT THAT IT MAKES THE WINDFALL FOR BUSINESS, FOR AIRBNBS AND HOTELS BECAUSE THE NIGHTLIFE IS ATTRACTIVE. THAT IS TRUE.
IT DOES HELP OTHER BUSINESSES, BUT THE SALES TAX IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE GET FROM THAT.
WE DON'T GET ANY PARKING REVENUE FROM MIDNIGHT TO 2:00.
SO ALL THE PARKING THAT HAPPENS IS FREE.
I JUST WANTED TO MAKE THAT REAL CLEAR.
I AM ALSO IN AGREEMENT THAT THESE CHANGES ARE A GOOD IDEA.
I CAN SUPPORT SOME OF THESE, BUT THE PROBLEM SEEMS TO BE THAT WE'RE NOT ENFORCING MOST OF THE THINGS WE HAVE IN PLACE.
EVEN THE RHIO REPORT REPORTED THAT EXACT THING.
I THINK THE QUOTE WAS THAT, BARS AND RESTAURANTS ARE NOT TAKEN TO TASK VERY OFTEN FOR VIOLATIONS AND THAT WAS ON PAGE 43 OF THE REPORT.
THE REASON FOR THAT IS YOU HAVE TO HAVE A LOT OF STAFF AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE TO ENFORCE THOSE THINGS.
SOME OF THE THINGS WE'VE MENTIONED IN THE ORDINANCE SO FAR, INCLUDING BARTENDERS NOT DRINKING, HAVING A LAST CALL, ARE ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE FOR A STAFF MEMBER OR ANYONE ELSE TO REPORT.
IT WOULD HAVE TO BE A REPORT FROM SOME CUSTOMER OR FROM ANOTHER EMPLOYEE.
PERSONALLY, I WOULD NOT PREFER TO HAVE AN ORDINANCE THAT WOULD INCLUDE ITEMS THAT WE KNOW ARE NOT GOING TO BE REINFORCED WHEN WE'RE NOT ALREADY ENFORCING SOME OF THE ORDINANCES THAT WE DO HAVE, PARTICULARLY THE SOUND ORDINANCE.
I'D BE REALLY CURIOUS TO FIND OUT WHAT HAPPENED TO THE IDEA OF THE SOCIAL ECONOMY ALLIANCE.
THAT WAS A REAL KEY IN THE RHI REPORT IT ALL SOUNDS GOOD ON PAPER.
I JUST HOPE THAT WE CAN CONTINUE WITH THAT.
I KNOW THAT THE CITY IS INTERESTED IN AND IT'S GOING TO.
WE NEED TO FOLLOW UP WITH THE LIGHTING WITH RIDESHARE AND MORE OF THE RHI REPORTS COMMENTED ON EMPLOYEE PARKING FOR SAFETY OF THE EMPLOYEES WHEN THEY LEAVE THE BUSINESS.
I THINK THOSE ARE THINGS THAT ARE OUTSIDE THE ORDINANCE THAT WE REALLY SHOULD CONCENTRATE ON AND HELP ALL OF THESE SITUATIONS.
I KNOW THAT THERE ARE SOME BUSINESSES THAT DO NOT OPEN UNTIL 12.
BUT THEY ARE VERY INTERESTED IN HAVING SOME OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE ONE OR TWO, MAYBE THREE OPPORTUNITIES THAT THEY WOULD STAY UP UNTIL TWO.
IT MAY BE A WEDDING RECEPTION OR A BIRTHDAY PARTY OR SOME SPECIAL CELEBRATION.
FOR THEM TO COMPLY WITH ANY RIGOROUS PERMIT WOULD BE A LITTLE OUT OF LINE.
INCLUDED WITH THE WAIVERS THAT WAS SUGGESTED BY THE STAFF FOR THOSE THREE HOLIDAYS, THAT WE COULD HAVE SOME KIND OF REDUCED PERMIT FOR INDIVIDUAL KNIGHTS.
JUST AN IDEA. THE OTHER THING,
[01:00:02]
I'M ALWAYS WANTED TO TWIST THINGS AROUND BACKWARDS.IF THIS ORDINANCE IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE PURSUE, TURNING IT INTO A POSITIVE WHERE THE CITY RECOGNIZES BARS AND RESTAURANTS THAT HAVE MET CERTAIN STANDARDS OF SECURITY TRAINING, CROWD TRAINING HAVE MET THE FIRE CODES.
THEY HAVE HEALTH DEPARTMENT PERMITS THAT ARE ACCEPTABLE, THAT THEY RECEIVE A RECOGNITION FROM THE CITY FOR HAVING THAT.
THOSE THAT DON'T RECEIVE THAT THEY ARE NOT SO THAT WHEN YOU WALK INTO AN ESTABLISHMENT, IT'S LIKE THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT, YOU CAN LOOK ON THE THING, YOU CAN SEE THE SCORE.
THEY GOT A NINE OR THEY GOT AN EIGHT.
IF THEY'VE GOT A THREE, YOU PROBABLY TURN AROUND AND LEAVE.
SOME RECOGNITION, JUST AN IDEA. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER BLONDER.
FIRST OF ALL, I WOULD LIKE TO ASK THE STAFF TO DISPLAY, PROJECT THIS SHEET THAT WE WERE GIVEN, THAT IS THE NUMBER OF DUIS BY TIME PERIOD.
COULD WE GET SOMEBODY TO DO THAT? WHILE THAT'S HAPPENING, I WANT TO BE VERY CLEAR THAT WHILE I WAS NOT AT THE JULY 28TH MEETING, I WAS AT A WORK CONFERENCE OVERSEAS.
I DID WATCH THE ENTIRE MEETING ONLINE, THE RECORDED MEETINGS, SO I AM FAMILIAR WITH THE EXTENSIVE PUBLIC COMMENT AS WELL AS THE DISCUSSION BETWEEN THE COMMISSIONERS AND QUESTIONS OF STAFF.
I HAVE REVIEWED ALL OF THAT VERY CAREFULLY.
I ACTUALLY JUST WANT TO PINPOINT THIS AND PERHAPS HAVE THE POLICE CHIEF COME UP FOR JUST A MOMENT TO EXPLAIN WHAT HAPPENS WITH THE DUI AND HOW LONG IT TAKES TO PROCESS THAT. THANK YOU, CHIEF.
>> MADAM MAYOR, COMMISSIONERS, JENNIFER MICHELLE, CHIEF OF POLICE IN AUGUSTINE.
COMMISSIONER BOND OR TO GET TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION CORRECTLY, FROM THE TIME WE MAKE A DUI, STOP, WHAT HAPPENS AT THAT POINT, AND HOW LONG IS THAT YOUR QUESTION?
>> WHEN YOU PULL SOMEBODY OVER WHEN A POLICE OFFICER PULLS SOMEBODY OVER FOR SUSPECTED DUI.
>> THEY CAN RANGE ANYWHERE FROM ONE HOUR IF THE OFFICER IS ONE OF OUR DUI OFFICERS THAT IS TRAINED THAT IS REALLY PROFICIENT AND QUICK IN IT ALL THE WAY UP TO FOUR HOURS.
IT DEPENDS ON THE LEVEL OF INTOXICATED BECAUSE THE INDIVIDUAL MAY HAVE TO GO TO THE HOSPITAL.
THAT OFFICER WILL BE OFF THE STREET FROM ANYWHERE AND AN HOUR'S QUICK FOR A DUI.
FROM THE TIME YOU STOP THEM, DO ALL YOUR FIELD SOBRIETY TESTS, TAKE THEM TO THE JAIL, HAVE THEM BLOW INTO THE INTOXILYZER, AND BOOK THEM.
BUT MOST PARTS, WE HAVE TO USUALLY TAKE THEM TO THE HOSPITAL BECAUSE THE JAIL WILL NOT ACCEPT THEM IF THEY BLOW OVER 0.3 WHEN THEY GET THERE.
THEY HAVE TO GO TO THE HOSPITAL TO BE CLEARED AND WE HAVE TO BASICALLY SIT WITH THEM UNTIL THEY ARE CLEARED BY MEDICAL PERSONNEL.
>> ALSO, AND I NEGLECTED TO ASK YOU TO PROVIDE THIS, SO I'LL ASK YOU TO DO IT VERBALLY.
YOU HAVE BEEN PROVIDING THE COMMISSIONERS BY EMAIL WITH THE MONTHLY SUMMARY OF ARRESTS THAT ARE COMPARING A YEAR-BY-YEAR COMPARISON. AM I RIGHT?
>> CORRECT. WE'LL COMPARE THE BLAST OF JULY TO JULY.
>> CAN YOU SUMMARIZE FOR US THE CHANGE IN DUIS FROM WHICHEVER YEARS? RECENT YEARS.
>> THROUGH OUR ENFORCEMENT EFFORTS OUR TRAFFIC MORNINGS AND OUR TRAFFIC CITATIONS HAVE TREMENDOUSLY HAVE GONE UP AND OUR CRASHES HAVE COME DOWN.
BUT WE'VE ALSO SEEN WHERE DUIS HAVE COME UP AND THAT CAN BE CONTRIBUTED TO WE HAVE DESIGNATED INDIVIDUALS THAT WORK IN THE EVENING NOW, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY FOCUS ON SO THEY CAN TAKE THOSE AWAY FROM THE OFFICERS THAT ARE ZONE OFFICERS ANSWERING CALLS, THOSE INDIVIDUALS CAN GRAB THE DUIS.
OVER LAST YEAR TO THIS YEAR, WE HAVE HAD AND INCREASE.
>> YES. I ACTUALLY WROTE THAT DOWN FOR YOU.
I HAD A FEELING THAT WAS COMING.
>> MAY WAS 21 THIS YEAR, LAST YEAR, 13.
I HAVE JUNE LAST YEAR, 16, THIS YEAR 21? YEAH. I DON'T HAVE THE LAST ONE THAT YOU SENT, BUT I DO RECALL THAT YOU SAID THAT IT WAS STILL GOING UP DESPITE THE FACT THAT WE WERE DOWN ONE DUI OFFICER.
[01:05:03]
>> THERE WERE STILL GOING UP DESPITE THE FACT THAT WE ONLY HAD ONE OFFICER OR JUST GENERAL OFFICERS WORKING DUI THANKS.
>> WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IN THESE GRAPHS, AND I WANT TO FOCUS ON CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE.
AGAIN, THIS IS COMPARING DIFFERENT TIME PERIODS, SO AND ALL IN THE EVENING, SO 06:00 PM.
TO EFFECTIVELY MIDNIGHT 11:59, THAT'S ABOUT SIX HOURS.
COMPARING THAT WITH THE 3 HOURS AFTER MIDNIGHT MIDNIGHT TO 03:00 A.M. AND WE ARE SEEING ON ALL OF THESE GRAPHS AND THE CHARTS, THE TABLES, AN INCREASE IN, EVEN THOUGH IT'S HALF THE TIME PERIOD, WE'RE SEEING AN INCREASE IN DUIS AFTER MIDNIGHT.
WHETHER THOSE I'M SORRY, GO AHEAD.
>> WHETHER THOSE DUIS ARE COMING FROM RESIDENCES OR WHATEVER, WE ARE SEEING A SIGNIFICANT INCREASE IN HALF THE TIME PERIOD OF DUIS.
I'M NOT GOING TO SAY THAT CORRELATION IS CAUSATION, BUT THE CLOSURE OF BARS AT 2 AM, THERE MAY BE SOME RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THAT.
THERE MAY BE AT LEAST SOME RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THAT.
I HAVE OBSERVED OVER THE PERIOD OF TIME I'VE LIVED IN THE CITY, AND ESPECIALLY SINCE 2005, A LOT OF INEBRIATED INDIVIDUALS.
AFTER MIDNIGHT, WALKING OUR STREETS.
I'VE SEEN A LOT OF IT. I JUST WANT TO MAKE THOSE POINTS.
I AM GOING TO RESERVE THE REST OF MY COMMENTS UNTIL AFTER I HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC.
I DO WANT TO HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC BEFORE.
>> CAN I ASK ONE QUESTION? ON YOUR CHART FOR THE PAST TWO YEARS, YOU LIST 42 DUIS FOR THE DOWNTOWN.
>> CORRECT. THAT MEANS THOSE PEOPLE WERE PULLED OVER IN THAT HISTORIC HP1 DISTRICT, THAT LITTLE AREA.
>> COULD YOU REPEAT THAT ON THIS CHART?
>> WHEN WE RAN THE NUMBERS FOR MS. SKINNER.
>> THAT'S IN OUR PACKET, NOT WHAT'S ON DISPLAY?
FOR THE PUBLIC THAT'S HERE, WE HAVE THE POLICE CALL DATA.
THESE ARE ONLY FOR THIS AREA THAT WE'VE BEEN DISCUSSING.
>> THANK YOU. I APPRECIATE THAT.
ANY MORE COMMENTS? GREAT. I'VE BEEN WITH THIS ISSUE FOR A LONG TIME, AND WE HAVE TWO NEW COMMISSIONERS AND MAYBE NOT HEARD ME SAY IT.
YOU PROBABLY HAVE HEARD ME SAY IT.
I BELIEVE THAT WE HAVE SET THREE DIFFERENT ECONOMIES IN THE CITY.
WHAT I'M ABOUT TO SAY IS THAT I'VE LEARNED THIS FROM THE RESPONSIBLE HOSPITALITY INSTITUTE, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT I PARTICIPATED IN FOR MANY YEARS NOW.
I'VE GONE TO THE ANNUAL CONFERENCES AND THAT'S HOW WE ENDED UP HIRING THEM TO COME AND WORK WITH US.
WHAT I'VE LEARNED WAS THAT WE HAVE THESE DIFFERENT ECONOMIES.
WE HAVE A DAYTIME ECONOMY, WE HAVE AN EVENING ECONOMY, AND WE HAVE A LATE NIGHT ECONOMY.
THAT LATE NIGHT ECONOMY IS WHAT WE'RE ADDRESSING.
EACH ECONOMY HAS ITS OWN SET OF NEEDS AND IT SHOULD HAVE ITS OWN SET OF REGULATIONS AND REQUIREMENTS AS FAR AS FROM THE GOVERNMENTAL OVERSIGHT STANDPOINT.
THAT'S REALLY HOW I'M APPROACHING IT AS A BUSINESS MIND.
THE REASON I GOT INVOLVED IN THIS WAS BECAUSE I SAW THE BALANCE THAT WE TALK ABOUT SO MUCH.
EVERYONE OF US AT THIS TABLE TALKS ABOUT BALANCE.
BALANCE BETWEEN THE RESIDENTS, THE BUSINESSES, AND THE VISITORS.
IT'S VERY PRECARIOUS AND IT'S VERY CHALLENGING TO CREATE THAT BALANCE.
WE HAVE SEEN IN THE LAST FEW YEARS NOT ONLY JUST DUIS RISE, BUT WE'VE ALSO SEEN DEATHS, GUN VIOLENCE.
WE'VE HAD BETWEEN THE HOURS OF MIDNIGHT AND 2:30 AFTER CLOSING, WE'VE SEEN JUST IN THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS, WE HAD JUST FEBRUARY WE HAD A SHOOTING DEATH ON ANASTASIA ISLAND WHICH IS A NEW AREA THAT WE HAVEN'T SEEN.
WE SEE ON OUR MAPS THAT IT'S ALSO THRIVING AND GROWING.
DOWNTOWN WAS THE ONE BEFORE OUTSIDE OF LOS DOS GATOS AFTER CLOSING TIME, SHOOTING, DEATH.
[01:10:01]
WE'VE HAD OTHER INJURIES AND PROBLEMS AND I HOPE THAT YOU TOOK THE TIME TO DO A LITTLE BIT OF RESEARCH TO HAVE GONE THROUGH THAT.THAT'S REALLY THE KEY TO WHY I'VE STUCK WITH THIS SO LONG.
BECAUSE WHEN I GO TO THE RESPONSE AT THE HOSPITALITY INSTITUTE TRAININGS, IT'S REALLY ALL ABOUT SAFETY.
IT'S REALLY FOCUSED ON A PROSPEROUS, VIBRANT, GOOD, SAFE NIGHTLIFE FOR EVERYONE.
FOR OUR VISITORS, FOR A RESIDENCE, FOR THE PEOPLE THAT WORK THERE, THE INDUSTRY PEOPLE.
THAT'S REALLY WHAT I'M RESPONDING TO.
I WANTED TO SAY THAT YOU HAD MENTIONED WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE NIGHTLIFE STUDY AND THERE ARE MANY PROBLEMS THAT ARE IDENTIFIED AND CALLED OUT BY CATEGORY IN THE STUDY RESULTS.
THEIR CONCERNS UNDER THE VENUE SAFETY SECTION, WE HAVE VENUE SAFETY, WE HAVE SOCIAL VENUES, WE HAVE PUBLIC SPACE, EACH SECTOR WAS ADDRESSED IN THIS STUDY.
IT REALLY WASN'T A STEADY SO MUCH AS IT WAS A PARTICIPATION AMONG THE CONSULTANTS AND THE COMMUNITY.
IT WAS MORE OF AN ASSESSMENT, BUT IT WAS REALLY MORE OF A PROCESS.
YOU ASKED THE QUESTION,NWHAT CAME OUT OF IT? THERE WAS A MEETING IN THE FINAL STEPS, MARCH 3RD, 2022.
THERE WAS A FINAL MEETING AND IT WAS WITH THE INDUSTRY AND IT WAS WITH JOHN REAGAN AND WE HAVE MINUTES.
WHAT WAS SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN, WHAT THE HOPE WAS IS THAT THE DOWNTOWN BUSINESSES WOULD DEVELOP THEIR OWN ALLIANCE AND BEGIN TO WORK WITH US TO CREATE A BETTER NIGHTLIFE FOR THEM AND FOR OUR VISITORS AND FOR RESIDENCE.
I THINK WE WANTED THE ASSESSMENT, WE WANTED TO IDENTIFY OUR WEAKNESSES AND STRENGTHS, AND WE WANTED TO REALLY HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH THE BUSINESSES.
BUT THAT NEVER HAPPENED AFTER NUMEROUS MEETINGS AND I SAY THAT WITH A LITTLE BIT OF FRUSTRATION.
I THINK IT WOULD BE POSITIVE IF ANYTHING, THAT CAME OUT OF THIS EXERCISE IN ADDITION TO A GOOD, SOLID ORDINANCE, THAT'S NOT OVERREACHING, BUT IT'S FAIR AND IS GOING TO BE FAIR TO EVERYONE INVOLVED, INCLUDING OUR RESIDENCE AND OUR VISITORS, AS WELL AS OUR BUSINESSES.
I WOULD HOPE THAT THAT WOULD HAPPEN.
WITH THAT SAID, I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC.
[2. GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENTS (Part 2 of 2)]
I'M VERY EAGER TO HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC FOR OPINIONS AND GUIDANCE AND SUGGESTIONS.>> JUST TO FOLLOW UP ON YOUR DISCUSSION ON THE VIOLENCE, THE DEATHS THAT WE'VE HAD.
WHAT WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON WAS A POINT IN TIME AND SINCE THEN THERE HAVE BEEN CHANGES FROM THE STATE SO THAT THERE'S NO PERMANENT CARRY NOW.
>> THAT MAKES GUNS EVERYWHERE.
>> I THINK IT JUST REINFORCES WHAT YOU JUST SPOKE ABOUT.
>> THANK YOU. SURE. JUMP ON BOARD.
THERE'S A LOT OF GOOD POINTS TO BE MADE AND LIKE I SAID, I'M EAGER TO HEAR FROM THE COMMUNITY ON WHAT WE HAVE TO SAY.
LIKE I SAID, I DO HOPE THAT WHEN WE HAVE SPEAKERS AT THE PODIUM, PLEASE ADDRESS THE COMMISSION DIRECTLY.
YOU'RE NOT HERE TO ADDRESS THE AUDIENCE.
PLEASE HOLD YOUR APPLAUSE AND PLEASE DO NOT SPEAK OUT LOUD AND CREATE A DISTURBANCE, OR PERHAPS INTIMIDATION TO YOUR NEIGHBOR OR YOUR SPEAKER.
FIRST SPEAKER UP IS JASON BEFORT.
I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PRONOUNCING NAMES.
>> THANK YOU. I'M NOT GOING TO COME UP HERE AND YOU GUYS HAVE ALL GOTTEN AN EMAIL FROM ME AND FROM MY EMPLOYER. I WILL SAY MS. SCARCE, YOU GET IT EVERYONE HERE YOU GET IT.
THE BARS AND RESTAURANTS WE DON'T DO THE MARKETING FOR THIS TOWN.
WE DON'T PUT THE BILLBOARDS ON THE INTERSTATES.
[01:15:02]
WE DON'T DO THE MARKETING AND SOUTH FLORIDA, TAMPA.WE DON'T BRING THE PEOPLE HERE.
WE SERVICE THEM ONCE THEY'RE HERE.
THE ONE THING THAT WE'RE GUILTY OF, REPEAT BUSINESS, WE BRING THEM BACK.
THIS WHOLE PRESENTATION YOU'VE DONE ALL IT'S DONE IS PROVED THAT WE DO A GOOD JOB, THAT WE HAVE TOO MANY PEOPLE COMING HERE, MAY BE WE'RE TOO POPULAR.
IT'S JUST LIKE PULLING INTO A FAST FOOD RESTAURANT AND ORDERING A DOUBLE CHEESEBURGER.
WE HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH PERSONAL, INDIVIDUAL DECISIONS.
PEOPLE WHO WALK OUT OF THE BUSINESS, WALKED DOWN THE SIDEWALKS.
THIS TOWN IS SAFE AND ONE THING THAT PROVES THAT THIS TOWN IS SAFE IS THE REPEAT BUSINESS.
THE WEDDINGS, THE BACHELORETTE PARTIES, THE VACATIONS, THE BEACH.
THEY ALL COME HERE BECAUSE IT'S SAFE AND IT'S REPEAT BUSINESS.
IT'S BECAUSE OF WHAT WE DO, NOT BECAUSE WHAT WE DO WRONG. THIS BECAUSE WHAT WE DO RIGHT? OUR BARS ARE PACKED, OUR RESTAURANTS ARE PACKED BECAUSE OF WHAT WE DO RIGHT NOT BECAUSE WHAT WE DO WRONG.
WHEN YOU DRIVE PAST NO NAME AND YOU SEE A PACKED PATIO.
IT'S NOT BECAUSE WE'RE DOING SOMETHING WRONG IT'S BECAUSE WE'RE DOING SOMETHING RIGHT.
WE HAVE DOORSTEP AT ALL THE BARS.
WE HAVE TRASH CANS AT ALL THE BARS.
WE HAVE AN ENTIRE PARKING LOT.
THE PARKING LOT HAS 120 SPACES, NEARLY 800 CARS ON A SATURDAY AFTERNOON, NOT ONE TRASH CAN.
THERE'S ONE TRASH CAN FROM THE FORK ALLEY ALL THE WAY TO RIVER AND PORT, THERE'S ONE TRASH CAN AND YOU WANT TO MAKE IT MY RESPONSIBILITY, WHILE LINES RESPONSIBILITY, ANYONE ELSE'S RESPONSIBILITY FOR TRASH ON THE GROUND WHEN THE CITY AND THE 4% THAT WE PAY IN SALES TAX, THERE'S ONLY ONE TRASH CAN.
I'M SORRY. YOU WANT TO PUT IT ON US? MAJORITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOODS ARE BEHIND ALL THE ACTIVE BARS AND RESTAURANTS.
WE'RE ALL ON THE WATERFRONT MAJORITY OF US, THERE'S NO BATHROOMS. THE ONLY THREE BATHROOMS ARE CLOSE ROUGHLY 9:00-9:30 AT NIGHT ON ST. GEORGE STREET.
THE MAJORITY OF WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, THE AFTER 12:00, THE FOOT TRAFFIC IS OUT ON THE WATERFRONT.
THERE'S NO BATHROOMS, VERY LITTLE TRASH CANS.
MS. GEARS. I CAN'T WAIT TO SIT NEXT TO YOU WHEN I RUN FOR CITY COUNCIL IN 2024. THANK YOU.
>> THOMAS DAY 19 SARAGOSA STREET IN THE CITY.
JUST A LITTLE TAKEN BACK BECAUSE THERE'S SO MUCH INFORMATION AVAILABLE.
AS YOU CAN PROBABLY TWIST IT ANYWAY YOU WANT.
THE FACT IS WE HAVE A PROBLEM LATE AT NIGHT AND THAT THE CITY HAS THE RIGHT TO TRY TO CONTROL IT.
I DON'T KNOW IF IT HAS TO BE DONE THROUGH ANOTHER ORDINANCE OR JUST MANAGING THE ORDINANCES THAT WE HAVE.
AS YOU POINTED OUT, WE NEED TO BACKUP THE TWO PIECES OF THE CURRENT ORDINANCE THAT DON'T SEEM TO BE ENFORCED.
MAY BE THAT'LL STRAIGHTEN THINGS OUT.
I CAME IN HERE ORIGINALLY READY TO SAY, I DON'T WANT THE BAR TENDERS TO HAVE ANY MORE ACCESS TO HOURS THAN ANYBODY.
I WAS HAPPY FEW YEARS AGO WHEN WE WENT TO 02:00 IN THE MORNING.
I THINK THAT THE COUNTY AND THE CITY DESERVES A LOT FOR BRINGING THESE CUSTOMERS HERE.
JUST AS THIS GENTLEMAN JUST POINTED OUT, THEY DON'T DO ANYTHING TO BRING THE CUSTOMERS HERE.
WAS DOING IT AS ALL THAT ADVERTISING THE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT ACCORDING TO ADVERTISING THAT HELP THEIR BUSINESS.
NOW THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO TAKE SOME OF THAT REVENUE AND BACKUP WHAT'S IN THE ORDINANCE THAT EXISTS OR WHATEVER YOU CHOOSE TO OFFER IT, BUT YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO THAT. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. HA. SMITH. FOLLOWED BY TRACY KAUFMAN.
OH, MR. SMITH WAS HERE TO TALK ABOUT GENERAL NIGHT NOISE.
TRACY KAUFMAN, FOLLOWED BY WARREN MARROW.
>> HEY, GOOD MORNING. I LIVE AT 30 CHARLOTTE STREET.
I'VE PROBABLY MADE ABOUT 400 PLUS CALLS IN THE LAST THREE YEARS THAT I'VE LIVED HERE.
THE '90S WHEN I LIVED HERE, THIS IS MY DREAM PLACE.
THE BARS WERE NOT AN ISSUE LIKE THEY ARE NOW, I DON'T FEEL LIKE THEY WERE AN ISSUE AND I DON'T RECALL HAVING TO CALL POLICE OFFICERS ONE TIME.
I'M A LITTLE EMOTIONAL ABOUT THIS BECAUSE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF IT,
[01:20:05]
I DRINKS THROWN ON ME.I HAVE PEOPLE URINATING IN MY YARD, CUSSING ME OUT, THREATENING ME, HAVING SEX IN MY BACKYARD AND ALLEYWAYS, DOING DRUGS, GIRLS CHOKING ON THEIR VOMIT ON THE SIDEWALKS, PEOPLE WALKING AROUND WITH OPEN CONTAINERS, THROWING BOTTLES IN THE STREETS.
I'M ASKING IS THAT THE SET ORDINANCES BE ENFORCED.
BUT THERE IS A METER READER AVAILABLE WHEN I CALL TO HAVE THOSE READINGS DONE NOT AN HOUR OR TWO LATER.
WHEN THE NOISE HAS STOPPED, I DON'T SLEEP.
IN ALL IT'S BEEN SAID TO ME, WE'LL MOVE.
DIDN'T YOU KNOW WHERE YOU WERE MOVING TO? I DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE TO DO.
IF I WAS FINANCIALLY ABLE TO, I'D BE GONE IN A HEARTBEAT AND NEVER LOOK AT MY REAR-VIEW MIRROR.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE SOLUTION IS.
BUT THIS HAS BEEN MY EXPERIENCE AND I HOPE THAT THERE CAN BE SOME TYPE OF RESOLUTION AND RESPECT FOR YOUR NEIGHBORS BECAUSE I HAVE CALLED BARS PERSONALLY AND ASK THEM, "COULD YOU PLEASE TURN IT DOWN?" THERE ANYTIME THAT I HAD COVID, I THINK I CALLED ALMOST EVERY NIGHT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE TO SAY HERE. I APPRECIATE IT.
WARREN MERRILL, FOLLOWED BY JANATA [INAUDIBLE].
GOT THAT ONE RIGHT? YEAH. MR. MERRILL. WELCOME BACK.
.>> HI. HOW ARE YOU GUYS DOING? REAL QUICK. MS. SKINNER MENTIONED SOME FIGURES.
SHE SAID BACK IN 2005 IS WHEN THEY CHANGED THE FORMAT, THE 2:00 AM, THEY JUST NEVER REVERSED IT.
IT WAS ACTUALLY IN 2010 JANUARY.
THE REASON BEHIND THAT WAS THAT THE OTHER COUNTIES SURROUNDING US INCLUDING ST. JOHNS COUNTY AND THE BEACH, THEY WENT TO 2:00 AM.
ACCORDING TO THE MAYOR WHO RETIRED JOHN REAGAN, WHAT'S HAPPENING IS WE'RE LOSING BUSINESS AND ACTUAL CUSTOMERS WHEN WE DIDN'T HAVE THE 2:00 AM TO THE SURROUNDING COUNTIES AND SURROUNDING CITIES.
I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT.
THEN THERE WAS ALSO MADE PERMANENT IN THE JULY MEETING AFTER THIS STATISTICS CAME BACK AND THE DENSITY MAYOR, THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS SEEK COMPETITOR.
THEY HAD ALL THE STATISTICS SAYING THAT THERE WAS NO INCREASE IN THE SAFETY ISSUES GOING FROM 1:00 AM TO 2:00 AM MS. SKINNER, SHE ALSO GAVE A BUNCH OF STATISTICS ABOUT THE INCREASE IN THE SOLID WASTE AND ALL THESE THINGS.
JUST VALIDATES THE FACT THAT OUR TOURISM HAS INCREASED ALMOST TENFOLD SINCE THESE STUDIES WERE MADE FROM BACK WHEN YOU'RE USING AS A REFERENCE POINT.
WITH RESPECT TO THE CALLS THE POLICE CHIEF WAS TALKING ABOUT CAUSE OF SERVICE.
I ADDED THEM UP, IT WAS 788 CALLS OVER A TWO-YEAR PERIOD.
THAT'S 760 DAYS, THAT'S 1.04 CALLS PER DAY.
WE GOT THESE NUMBERS YOU HAVE TO PUT THEM IN PERSPECTIVE INSTEAD OF LOOKING AT THE ABSOLUTE NUMBER OF NUMBERS. SAME WITH THE DUI.
I DID A QUICK LOOK IN THE ONLINE REAL QUICK WHILE THEY'RE TALKING, THERE WAS 151 DUIS PER 100,000 RESONANCE ON AVERAGE DUIS IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA.
IF YOU TAKE MS. SKINNER IS FIGURE FOR THREE MILLION, WHICH I THINK IS MORE THAT WOULD EQUATE TO 4,500 DUIS, NOT THE 145 IN ST. AUGUSTINE.
YOU HAD TO PUT INTO PERSPECTIVE THESE NUMBERS YOU CAN'T TAKE MOTHER ABSOLUTE SENSE IF YOU GOT TO PUT THEM IN PERSPECTIVE.
I WROTE A LOT OF STUFF LIKE CHICKEN SCRATCH HERE.
[LAUGHTER] BUT ANYWAYS, ONE THING IS FUNNY HERE TOO, IS YOU HAVE THESE RESIDENTS WHO ARE UPSET.
ONE THING I HAD TO GO THROUGH AND THE CLINIC QUARTERS HAD TO GO THROUGH.
I GET TO USE BY EXCEPTION TO DO WHAT I WANT TO DO WHERE YOU HAD POSTINGS, GET THE PINK SIGNS THAT MAIL OUT STUFF TO EVERYBODY AND EVERYBODY SHOWS UP.
IF THEY HAVE OPPOSITE AS OPPOSITION AND THEY HAVE A CHANCE TO SAY IN THE CITY COMMISSIONERS HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PUT RESTRICTIONS ON THAT USE.
PERMIT BY USE TO BE A BAR OR RESTAURANT WITH ALCOHOL.
GOT TODD GRAN, DAVE, THEY WERE PART OF THAT WHOLE TIME PERIOD THAN I WAS THERE.
RESONANCE AT 48 SPANISH STREET.
[01:25:03]
THAT WAS MY ORIGINAL INTENT, BUT THE PROPERTY THERE, THE OLD COSMIC PIZZA, WE DID THE WHOLE PROCESS IN SPANISH TREAT RESIDENTS. MR. BENTO.[INAUDIBLE] AND FOLLOWED BY SCOTT YORK. NEXT SPEAKER.
I LIVE AT 0105 COLOGNE AVENUE.
I WANT TO THANK THE COMMISSION FOR LISTENING TO THE EXTENSIVE PUBLIC COMMENT.
I THINK YOU GUYS CAN PROBABLY TELL A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE A LOT OF PASSIONATE FEELINGS ON THIS SUBJECT.
IT'S INTERESTING TO ME AS A NIGHTLIFE PROFESSIONAL THAT THE BIGGEST CONTENDER IN THE NIGHTLIFE INDUSTRY OF ST. AUGUSTINE AND THE BIGGEST MONEYMAKER, WHICH IS THE WEDDING INDUSTRY, IS NOWHERE IN THESE NIGHTLIFE CONVERSATIONS.
I THINK THAT I HAVE A BIRD'S EYE VIEW ON THE PERSPECTIVE HAVING BEEN A PERFORMER AT WEDDINGS AND IN LOCAL BARS.
I'VE WITNESSED 200 PEOPLE DRINK AT AN OPEN BAR FOR SIX HOURS AT A WEDDING, AND THEN SHOW UP AT A BAR THAT I'M PLAYING AT LATER.
[NOISE] IT'S A LITTLE BIT FONDLING HOW YOU WOULD HOLD THE SERVICE INDUSTRY SIDE ACCOUNTABLE WHEN SOMEONE'S PURCHASED A VERY LARGE BAR PACKAGE FOR 200 PEOPLE AND THEY'VE ENJOYED THEMSELVES AND HAD A GOOD NIGHT.
IT'S JUST INTERESTING TO ME IN THE NIGHTLIFE CONVERSATION THAT THE WEDDING INDUSTRY DOESN'T HAVE AS BIG OF A SPOTLIGHT PUT ON IT BECAUSE I THINK WE DEFINITELY ENTERTAIN THOSE GUESTS ALL WEEKEND.
THEY COME HERE TO PARTY, AND WHEN I SEE LOCALS OUT THAT I SEE REPEAT BUSINESS, THOSE PEOPLE ARE NEVER AS INTOXICATED AS THE PEOPLE WHO CAME AND MADE A WEEKEND OF IT IN ST. AUGUSTINE.
I JUST WANTED TO CALL ATTENTION TO THAT BECAUSE I WAS ON THE NIGHTLIFE COMMITTEE THAT WAS APPOINTED AND WE DID HAVE A LOT OF CONVERSATIONS AND PERFUNCTORY SOCIAL VENUES, GO THROUGH A LOT OF LICENSING AND PROCESSES TO BE HERE AND HAVE RESPONSIBLE CROWD MANAGEMENT AND WHEN YOU TAKE GROUP SETTINGS OF THAT SIZE AND CALIBER AND HAVE AN OPEN BAR, IT'S DEFINITELY A GAME CHANGER.
>> THANK YOU. SCOTT YORK, FOLLOWED BY JACKIE HARD.
>> I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR HOLDING THIS FORUM TODAY.
I AM A RESIDENT OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
I LIVE AT 29 SPANISH STREET AND PREVIOUSLY AT 42 ST. GEORGE STREET ABOVE WHETSTONE CHOCOLATES.
I'VE BEEN IMPACTED FOR THE LAST FIVE YEARS OF THE NOISE AND THE NOISE IS THE BIGGEST CONCERN OF MINE, AND I KNOW THAT THERE IS A CURRENT NOISE ORDINANCE, BUT I'VE ON MULTIPLE OCCASIONS HAD TO CALL ON BOARDS THAT JUST THE MUSIC IS TOO LOUD INSIDE OF MY HOUSE.
IF I CAN'T SLEEP INSIDE OF THE HOUSE, I'M NOT ASKING TO SLEEP IN MY BACKYARD, BUT I AM ASKING THAT AT LEAST THAT PART OF IT BE ENFORCED.
WHEN I READ THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE CHANGES AND THE NEW ORDINANCE, I SAW IN THERE TAKING AWAY THE RIGHT OF A BARTENDER TO DRINK ON THEIR JOB, AND WHEN THAT WAS READ OUT HERE, I HEARD PEOPLE SIGN AND EVEN HEARD ONE OR TWO SAY, OH, I'LL QUIT.
BUT THERE ARE RESTRICTIONS THAT DO NEED TO BE PUT IN PLACE TO BE ABLE TO ENFORCE THOSE CURRENT ORDINANCES THAT ARE IN THERE.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE FEES ARE FOR THIS PERMIT TO STAY OPEN AFTER MIDNIGHT, YOU'RE NOT ASKING THE BUSINESSES TO CLOSE AT MIDNIGHT, YOU'RE JUST ASKING THEM TO GET A PERMIT.
WHATEVER THAT PERMANENT IS, I'M SURE THAT ALMOST EVERY BAR IN THIS TOWN CAN AFFORD TO DO THAT.
HAVE THOSE FEES BEEN MADE PUBLIC? WHAT THOSE WOULD BE WOULD BE MY QUESTION. THANK YOU.
>> JACKIE HARD, FOLLOWED BY VIRGINIA WHETSTONE.
ANYBODY ELSE NEED TO TURN IN A SPEAKER CARD? WE'RE COMING TO THE END OF OUR PUBLIC COMMENT, PERIOD.
PLEASE TURN YOUR SPEAKER GUARD IN.
I HAVE LIVED IN ST. AUGUSTINE.
>> JACKIE, WOULD YOU PLEASE, THANK YOU.
>> JACKIE HARD 122 [INAUDIBLE].
I'VE LIVED IN THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE SINCE 1988, AND AT THAT RESIDENCES, 1990.
[NOISE] WHAT I WANT TO BRING TO THE TABLE TODAY IS MY EXPERIENCE WITH THE GIGGLING GATOR.
THE GIGGLING GATOR OPENED, I BELIEVE IN 2001,
[01:30:01]
THEY CLOSED IT IN 2019.I HAD 17 AND HALF YEARS OF DEALING WITH THEIR NOISE, THE DISRUPTION, AND IN THE LATTER STAGES, DRUGS, PROSTITUTION, MURDERS, RAPES, PEOPLE DEFECATING IN MY YARD, AND EVERYTHING ELSE THAT THE LADY SAID THAT SHE'S EXPERIENCED IN AUSTERLITZ STREET.
AS SOON AS THE GIGGLING GATOR CLOSED, MY NEIGHBORHOOD WAS BACK TO WHAT IT WAS BEFORE THAT.
I UNDERSTAND FROM THE BARS PERSPECTIVE, THE REGULATIONS FROM CITY.
BUT I ALSO THINK THAT THE CITY NEEDS TO ENFORCE THE RULES AND FIND THE FUNDING TO MAKE IT ENFORCEABLE.
IF THERE'S A PROBLEM BAR, YOU NEED TO ADDRESS IT.
THANKFULLY, THIS BAR DID CLOSE, BUT I HAD 17 AND HALF YEARS OF THIS AND IT AFFECTED MY HEALTH.
I WAS PERSONALLY ATTACKED ON THE PROPERTY.
I HAD PEOPLE CONFRONTING ME AND IT FELT LIKE IT WAS THEIR RIGHT.
THEY PARKED IN MY PROPERTY AND I WAS CONSTANTLY HAVING TO ASK THEM TO PLEASE NOT PARK IN HERE, AND THEN I WOULD HAVE TO CALL THE POLICE TO ENFORCE IT.
THERE IS A MIDDLE GROUND, AND I THINK THE STARTING POINT IS ENFORCING THE CURRENT LAWS ON THE BOOKS. THAT'S ALL. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU. VIRGINIA WHETSTONE, FOLLOWED BY MELINDA RECONZE. MORE CARDS.
>> COMMISSIONERS, I'M IN FULL SUPPORT OF THE PROPOSED ALCOHOL AND NOISE ORDINANCE.
I LIVE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, OUR OWN LONG-TERM RESIDENTIAL RENTALS.
I OWN COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES AND HOTELS ALL IN THE AFFECTED AREAS AND I HAVE EXPERIENCED THE NOISE, PROPERTY DAMAGE, TENANTS MOVING OUT, AND HOTEL GUESTS DEMANDING REFUNDS, ALL RELATED TO NOISE AND ALCOHOL.
I'M REQUESTING ONE CHANGE TO THE EXISTING ORDINANCE, PAGE 4, SECTION 4-3, ITEM B, NUMBER 6.
YOU ARE ALLOWING ESTABLISHMENTS TO HAVE AMPLIFIED MUSIC ON FRIDAY AND SATURDAY UP TO 12 MIDNIGHT.
IT APPEARS YOU HAVE NOT CONSIDERED THOSE PROPERTIES THAT LIKE RESIDENTS EXPECT TO HAVE QUIET ENJOYMENT.
I'M REFERRING TO OUR TRANSIENT VISITORS WHO STAY IN HOTELS AND BED AND BREAKFAST.
NUMEROUS TIMES, I'VE HAD GUESTS COMPLAINTS ABOUT A SPECIFIC BAR ACROSS THE STREET FROM MARGARET HOTEL AND MARINA.
BY THE WAY, THE NOISE ORDINANCE IS ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS THAT YOU HAVE NOW.
NEVER AS EFFECTIVE, IT DOESN'T WORK.
ON THE WEEKENDS, THIS BAR HAS PLAYED LOUD AMPLIFIED MUSIC WITH THEIR DOORS FULLY OPEN.
MY GUESTS CAN HEAR THIS INSIDE THEIR ROOMS WHILE TRYING TO SLEEP.
SOME HAVE CHECKED OUT AFTER 11:00 PM AND DEMANDED A FULL REFUND WHILE OTHERS DEMAND A REFUND IN THE MORNING.
THIS REFUND ON WEEKENDS COST MY HOTEL MORE THAN $350 A NIGHT.
THE LATEST REFUND BECAUSE OF NOISE OCCURRED ABOUT TWO MONTHS AGO.
IT'S UNFAIR THAT HOTELS MUST FINANCIALLY LOSE REVENUE BECAUSE OF ANOTHER BUSINESS'S DESIRE TO MAKE MONEY.
THIS IS NOT FAIR AND OUR HOTEL GUESTS DESERVE BETTER.
I STRONGLY SUGGEST THAT YOU MODIFY THE ORDINANCE TO 10:00 PM ON FRIDAY AND SATURDAY TO MATCH THE REST OF THE WEEK.
THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE FOR QUIET ENJOYMENT ON ANY DAY OF THE WEEK.
GUEST IN A HOTEL EXPECT A GOOD NIGHT SLEEP JUST AS YOU EXPECT A GOOD NIGHT SLEEP AT YOUR HOME.
I WANT TO ADDRESS ONE OTHER THING.
HOW DO I PUT SOMETHING ON THE SCREEN? THIS IS A CRASH THAT OCCURRED IN 2019 BY A DRUNK COUNTY RESIDENT WHO HAD NO CLUE WHERE THEY WERE GOING.
THEY DROVE IN OUR RESTRICTED PARKING LOT AT THE BAY FRONT END AND CRASHED INTO THIS VEHICLE, PUSHING THIS VEHICLE THROUGH THE ARCHES AND HITTING THE DOOR TO THIS GUEST ROOM.
SOMETHING NEEDS TO BE DONE ABOUT ALCOHOL. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU MS. WHITESTONE. MELINDA WECONSEY FOLLOWED BY STEPHEN HUDSON.
>> MELINDA WECONSEY 86 MAGNOLIA AVENUE.
[01:35:04]
I HAD PRE [INAUDIBLE] REMARKS, BUT AFTER HEARING A LOT OF THE CHANGES OF THINGS, I WANT TO SAY, A, IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT THE NOISE ORDINANCE BE PART OF THIS BECAUSE YOU NEED TO TIE THE NOISE TO THE ESTABLISHMENTS THAT ARE MAKING IT.THEY KNOW HOW LOUD THE AMPLIFICATION IS.
THEY CAN GO AND TELL PEOPLE WHEN TO TURN IT DOWN.
AS IT'S BEEN SAID EARLIER, ALL THIS IS TALKING ABOUT IS OUTSIDE AMPLIFIED NOISE.
AS THE MAYOR SAID, IF YOU'RE INSIDE, YOU GOT YOUR DOORS AND WINDOWS CLOSED, YOU CAN BE AS LOUD AS YOU WANT JUST SO PEOPLE OUTSIDE CAN HEAR.
THE DECIBEL READING THING HAS NEVER WORKED, WE KNOW THAT.
TYING THIS IN, THIS IS SO FRUSTRATING TO ME BECAUSE YOUTH HAD BEEN HERE, I'VE BEEN WATCHING THIS FOR YEARS, GO ON AND ON.
WHY IT DIDN'T GET PASSED BACK IN 2021? DON'T KNOW, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE PASSED.
LIKE THE MAYOR SAID BEFORE, WE HAVE FLORIDA CITIES THAT ARE ROLLING BACK THEIR DRINKING HOURS, WE'RE NOT PROPOSING THAT.
THIS IS A VERY FAIR COMPROMISE TO EVERYONE INVOLVED TO SIMPLY ASK FOR A PERMIT BETWEEN MIDNIGHT AND TWO O'CLOCK WHERE YOU'RE REGULATED AND THEN IF YOU BREAK NOISE ORDINANCES OR YOU HAVE DRUNKS.
THIS BUSINESS OF SAYING THAT'S THE WHOLE IDEA OF HAVING A TRAINED PERSON BE ABLE TO RECOGNIZE WHEN SOMEONE'S HAD TOO MUCH TO DRINK WHEN THEY COME IN TO THE ESTABLISHMENT.
THAT'S WHAT THE TRAINING IS ALL ABOUT.
YES, THERE'S PEOPLE THAT ARE COMING FROM WEDDINGS.
YES, THERE'S PEOPLE THAT HAVE BEEN DRINKING AT HOME OR DRINKING SOMEWHERE ELSE, BUT WHEN THEY COME INTO THAT ESTABLISHMENT, THAT'S WHAT THE TRAINING IS ALL ABOUT TO BE RESPONSIBLE IF NOTHING ELSE IT CUTS DOWN ON OVER-DRINKING AND I WOULD THINK IT WOULD HELP ON THE LIABILITY TO THE BARS.
SO MUCH OF THIS IS COMMON SENSE AND IT SHOULD NOT BE ONEROUS TO THE RESPONSIBLE ESTABLISHMENTS THAT WE HAVE.
HAVING THINGS LIKE LAST CALL, SECURITY ON THERE AND NOT ALLOWING BARTENDERS TO DRINK WHILE THEY'RE ON DUTY.
I WANT US TO HAVE A VITAL TOWN, BUT NOT KNOWN AS A PARTY TOWN.
AS FAR AS THE ADVERTISING GOES, OUR ADVERTISING HAS CHANGED.
IT HAS BEEN TAKEN OFF OF HISTORY AND BEING THE NATION'S OLDEST AND WE'RE FOCUSING ON OUR NIGHTLIFE AND RESTAURANTS.
THAT'S WHAT'S ATTRACTING PEOPLE.
THE MONEY FROM THESE BARS AND RESTAURANTS THAT ARE INSISTING THAT THE ADVERTISING GOING MORE TOWARDS BRINGING PEOPLE FOR THE NIGHT LIFE.
THIS IS NOT IN LINE WITH OUR VISION AT ALL THAT THE BUSINESSES AND RESIDENTS WORKED ON TOGETHER.
NEVER WAS PART OF OUR VISION TO BE A PARTY TOWN OR A DRINKING TOWN.
IT WAS TO BE A SMALL, HISTORIC, LIVABLE CITY. THANK YOU.
>> STEPHEN HUDSON, FOLLOWED BY MARTHA MICLER.
>> HELLO COMMISSION. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS.
>> PLEASE SPEAK INTO THE MIC. THANK YOU.
>> SORRY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR EVERYONE'S PUBLIC COMMENTS TODAY AND THANK YOU FOR ALL THE TIME THAT YOU'VE PUT INTO THIS.
I THINK THERE'S AN IMPORTANT DISTINCTION BETWEEN THE RHS STUDY, WHICH IS VERY COMPREHENSIVE AND A TRUE ECONOMIC IMPACT STUDY.
A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE THROWN OUT ECONOMIC FIGURES BUT THAT IS TRULY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT A TRUE ECONOMIC IMPACT STUDY IS.
UNDERSTANDING THE FACTORS THAT SOMETHING LIKE THIS WOULD DO TO EVERY SINGLE TYPE OF BUSINESS IN OUR CITY.
SIDE NOTE, LAST MEETING FOR THE FIRST READING.
SPEAKING WITH SOME OF THE RESIDENTS THAT WERE IN FAVOR OF THIS, THEY JUST TRULY WANTED IT FOR THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION DISTRICT.
THEY DIDN'T WANT IT FOR THE ENTIRE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE.
SOME OF THE BUSINESS OWNERS WERE LIKE, WELL, YOU DO REALIZE THAT I'M IN THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE AND THEY'RE LIKE, OH NO, WE DON'T WANT IT TO IMPACT YOU, WE JUST WANTED TO IMPACT THE PEOPLE IN HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SIDE NOTE, NOISE SEEMS TO BE THE MAIN PUBLIC CONCERN.
[01:40:04]
ENFORCEMENT OF THE ORDINANCE OR CHANGING THE ORDINANCE SHOULD BE LOOKED INTO.THREE, STREET LIGHTING, JUST MAKING DOWNTOWN BETTER LIT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE OR WHAT THE FINANCIAL IMPACT WOULD BE ON THE CITY.
BUT CRIME HAPPENS LESS IN WELL-LIT AREAS.
THEN SPECIFICALLY TO LOOK INTO THE THE ORDINANCE IN REFERENCE TO SHIFT DRINKING, I SAW THAT IT WAS QUOTED, "A LOT OF OUR ESTABLISHMENTS HAVE PIVOTED TO BEING CRAFT COCKTAIL BARS.
THE BAR IN AND OF ITSELF IS LIKE A KITCHEN.
PEOPLE HAVE VERY SPECIFIC DEMANDS OF WHAT THEIR DRINK TASTES LIKE.
SOMEONE SAYS, I WOULD LIKE THIS TYPE OF DRINK, I DON'T WANT IT TOO SWEET.
WELL, IF WE DEVIATE FROM OUR SET RECIPE, THAT ACTUALLY HAS TO BE TASTED BY A BARTENDER.
UNDER THIS, THAT WOULD BE ILLEGAL AND WE COULD LOSE OUR LICENSE POTENTIALLY BECAUSE OF THAT.
PLEASE LOOK INTO THAT. THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU MR. HUDSON. MARTHA MICLER, FOLLOWED BY MARTIN CLEARY.
>> MARTHA MICLER, 30, SPANISH STREET.
FIRST, I WANT TO THANK THE COMMISSION FOR BRINGING THIS TOPIC BACK UP AND PROVIDING AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE THE PUBLIC HEARING TODAY.
I'VE LISTENED VERY CAREFULLY TO YOUR COMMENTS, LISTENED VERY CAREFULLY TO THE PRESENTATION, AND TO ALL THE PUBLIC SPEAKING.
I DO WANT TO SAY THAT I'M A LONG-TERM RESIDENT, ACTUALLY A NATIVE OF ST. AUGUSTINE.
I HAVE LIVED IN THIS HISTORIC AREA FOR MANY YEARS, GREW UP THERE, AND MOVED BACK THERE.
I RECENTLY HAD A SHORT-TERM RENTAL, BUT WE HAVE TURNED THAT INTO A LONG-TERM RENTAL.
I HAVE TWO OTHER LONG-TERM RENTAL PROPERTIES.
WHEN I SAW VIRGINIA WHETSTONE PICTURE SHOWING THAT CAR THAT RAN INTO HER PROPERTY, I WISH I COULD HAVE BROUGHT A PICTURE OF WHEN A DRUNK DRIVER RAN INTO MY GRANDMOTHER'S HOUSE, WHICH IS ONE OF THE MOST PHOTOGRAPHED HOUSES ON SPANISH STREET.
WE HAVE A TENANT LIVING IN THAT HOUSE.
BUT IT NOT A HOLE IN THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE, AND THE DRIVER LEFT.
WE'LL SAY THAT THE DRIVER'S FATHER CAME BACK LATER AND TOOK CARE OF IT.
BUT I AGREE ALSO THAT THE NOISE ORDINANCE THAT WE HAVE NOW DOES NOT WORK.
WE TRIED THAT NOISE ORDINANCE FOR MANY YEARS, AND WE HAVE A LOCAL ESTABLISHMENT DOWN THE STREET FROM US, AND IT IS VERY DIFFICULT.
YOU NEED TO KEEP THAT NOISE ORDINANCE IN YOUR EXISTING ORDINANCE.
I ASKED YOU TO PROTECT OUR HISTORIC CITY, AND I AGREE WE NEED TO HAVE BALANCE IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA.
I JUST ENCOURAGE YOU TO BRING THIS ORDINANCE BACK TO THE CITY COMMISSION SO THAT YOU CAN APPROVE THE FIRST READING AND THEN LISTEN TO MORE PUBLIC COMMENT AFTER YOU APPROVE THE FIRST READING.
AGAIN, I DID AGREE WITH MANY OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT MS. SKINNER PUT FORTH, EXCEPT FOR THE NOISE PART.
I THINK THE NOISE IS SOMETHING THAT YOU NEED TO KEEP IN THERE.
LISTEN TO YOUR DOWNTOWN RESIDENTS.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR LISTENING TO US.
>> THANK YOU. MARTIN CLEARY, FOLLOWED BY ROB CRABTREE.
>> I JUST HAD A COMMENT ABOUT SAFETY IN GENERAL, AND HAVING THE 27 BARS THAT CLOSE AT 2 AM ALLOWS FOR A BIT OF A SOFTER CLOSE TO THE CITY.
I'M BARTENDER OR A BARN ON SALOON ON THE ISLAND.
[01:45:01]
IF YOU KICK EVERYBODY OUT AT MIDNIGHT, YOU'VE GOT EVERYBODY ON THE STREETS AT MIDNIGHT, ALL TRYING TO GET HOME AT THE SAME TIME.THEY'RE PROBABLY MAKING MORE NOISE.
IT SEEMS LIKE THE NOISE AND THE CLOSING TIME ARE TWO DIFFERENT ISSUES.
ANYWAY, I JUST THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE LESS SAFE TO KICK EVERYBODY AT MIDNIGHT INSTEAD OF ALLOWING PEOPLE TO LEAVE OVER A TWO-HOUR PERIOD.
IS ONLY 27 BARS STILL OPEN AT THAT POINT? SEEMS SMALL. THAT'S ALL.
>> ALRIGHT, MR. CLAIRE. THANK YOU.
ROB CRABTREE IS MY LAST SPEAKER CARD.
>> ROB CRABTREE. I'M A CITY RESIDENT, ALSO OWN A BAR ON ST. GEORGE STREET CALLED A BOAT DRINKS.
I HAVE A COUPLE OF COMMENTS. I'LL LEAVE IT PRETTY QUICK.
REGARDING RESPONSIBLE VENDOR TRAINING, FOR THOSE OF YOU THAT AREN'T INDUSTRY THAT DON'T KNOW.
FOR THE MOST PART, ALL OF OUR INSURANCE COMPANIES RECOMMEND THIS BECAUSE IT HELPS REDUCE OUR INSURANCE FEES.
ANY GOOD ESTABLISHMENT ALREADY HANDLES THESE KINDS OF PRACTICES.
I DON'T FEEL LIKE IT'S SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE ENFORCED BY AT THE CITY LEVEL.
WITH REGARDS TO THE DATA THAT WE'RE SEEING ON DUIS, YOU CAN MAKE DATA SAY ANYTHING.
ARE WE ENFORCING MORE DUIS? IT'S QUITE POSSIBLE.
AND MAYBE THAT'S WHY WE'RE SEEING AN INCREASE IN DUIS.
BUT RIGHT NOW, IT SEEMS AS THOUGH THE COMMISSION IS PUTTING THE ONUS COMPLETELY ON BARS AND RESTAURANTS DOWN HERE FOR DUIS AND THE SEA.
IT'S A GROWING PROBLEM EVERYWHERE IN THE STATE, EVERYWHERE IN THE COUNTRY.
WHAT I DON'T SEE IS ANY FOCUS ON RIDE SHARE.
NOTHING ABOUT THE CITY IS FOCUSING ON PUTTING MORE RIDE-SHARE HERE.
THERE'S MOST OF MY CUSTOMERS CANNOT FIND UBERS, LIFTS AT ANYTIME AT NIGHT, LET ALONE LATE NIGHT.
I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT THE CITY SHOULD FOCUS ON.
ALSO, I FEEL AS THOUGH THERE'S NO ENFORCEMENT OF OPEN CONTAINERS.
I KNOW THERE'S A LAW IN TOWN ON ST. GEORGE STREET.
I TURN AWAY CUSTOMERS ALL DAY LONG, EVERY DAY, THAT ARE WALKING IN MY ESTABLISHMENT WITH AN OPEN CONTAINER, WHETHER THEY BROUGHT IT FROM THEIR CAR, THEIR AIRBNB, THEIR HOTEL.
I SEE PEOPLE WALKING DOWN THE STREET WITH BOTTLES OF BEER. ALL OF THIS STUFF.
IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S NOT ENFORCED.
IF YOU HAVE REGULATION MUCH LIKE THE NOISE ORDINANCE, ENFORCE IT.
DON'T BUNDLE THINGS INTO THIS.
THE OTHER THING I'M GOING TO SAY IS THAT WHILE THE GIS MAPS WERE REALLY NICE TO SEE THE HEAT MAPS, THERE'S NOTHING THAT CORRELATES THAT TO THE NUMBER OF INCIDENTS WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND ALCOHOL.
NOT EVERYTHING THERE IS CORRELATED FOR EVERY CALL; JUST BECAUSE THERE'S A CALL AFTER MIDNIGHT DOES NOT MEAN THAT IT'S ALCOHOL-RELATED.
THAT'S JUST A CORRELATION THAT IS BEING PUT ON THAT DATA.
IT DOES SEEM AS THOUGH THE TAIL'S WAGGING THE DOG ON THIS WITH THE FOCUS ON LAW ENFORCEMENT ZONE 1, WHICH IS THE HISTORIC REGION.
BUT THEN, THIS ORDINANCE IS CITYWIDE.
WE'RE LOOKING AT A MICROCOSM OF THEOCRACY IN WHICH IT ISN'T OUR TOURIST AREA, BUT WE'RE THEN EXTRAPOLATING TO ALL OF THE CITY.
THEN THE LAST THING I'M GOING TO SAY IS THIS ORDINATE SEEMS TO MAKE IT REALLY CLEAR THAT THE INCREASE OF TOURISM IS A PROBLEM FOR OUR CITY.
IF THAT IS TRULY A POINT OF CONCERN, WHY ARE WE LOOKING AT JUST BARS AND RESTAURANTS? IS THERE ANYTHING BEING DONE TO REGULATE THE NUMBER OF HOTELS AND THE NUMBER OF ROOMS THAT WE KEEP EXPANDING IN THE CITY? THANK YOU.
IT'S GETTING TO BE, IT'S 10-11, SO I THINK IT'S WORKING OUT WELL.
>> HELLO. I'M TIERRA KENDLER, I LIVE AT 140 TWINE STREET AND I ALSO HAVE A DUPLEX OVER ON LIBERIA.
I JUST WANTED TO CHIME IN ON A COUPLE OF THINGS.
AS A REALTOR, WE ALL KNOW THAT ST. JOHNS COUNTY IS JUST EXPANDING AT EXPONENTIAL RATES, AND SO WHEN THAT HAPPENS, WE HAVE THE COMPETITION OF EVERYTHING RAISES TO MEET THE DEMAND.
IT'S QUITE A BLESSING BECAUSE I WENT TO HIGH SCHOOL IN A SMALL TOWN THAT IS VERY BLIGHTED AND IT'S GETTING WORSE REGULARLY BECAUSE THEY WOULD NEVER ALLOW ANY ADVANCEMENT.
WHAT I WILL SAY ABOUT THE NOISE ORDINANCE IS I LIVE IN LINCOLNVILLE, SO IF YOU CAN HEAR A PIN DROP BACK THERE, AND I HAVE TO WALK THREE-QUARTERS OF A MILE IF I WANT TO WALK INTO TOWN.
WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO PEOPLE THAT ARE LIVING LIKE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE DISTRICT, I UNDERSTAND THEIR CONCERNS, BUT IF IT'S ME, I WOULD NEVER LIVE THERE BECAUSE I KNOW THAT THERE'S BARS, THERE'S RESTAURANTS, THERE'S PEOPLE WALKING AROUND, THERE'S WEDDINGS.
AGAIN, WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO PEOPLE THAT DO LIVE RIGHT THERE IN THE HEART OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
I THINK THAT THE NOISE IS GOING TO BE EXPECTED THE SAME THING WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE RENTING AN AIRBNB.
[01:50:02]
IF I'M GOING TO SAVANNAH OR ANY OF THESE PLACES, I'M NOT GOING TO RUN AN AIRBNB RIGHT IN THE HEART OF SOMETHING RIGHT NOW THERE'S GOING TO BE BARS AND RESTAURANTS.I WILL SAY THAT ABOUT MY FEELINGS ON THE NOISE ORDINANCE.
AS FAR AS THE AMPLIFIED MUSIC, WHATEVER NOISE ORDINANCE YOU'VE PUT IN PLACE, IF YOU HAVE A LIVELY NIGHTLIFE, IT'S GOING TO CAUSE NOISE.
THERE'S REALLY NO WAY AROUND IT, SO WATERS IT DOWN TO CREATE SUCH STRINGENT AND THEN TO ALSO PUT THE BURDEN ON THE HOSPITALITY INDUSTRY, TO PUT THE BURDEN OF A LOT OF THESE THINGS ON THE BARS.
PEOPLE CRASHING THROUGH HOUSES.
THEY CAN DO THAT, BEING AT THEIR HOUSE, DRUNK.
THEY CAN GET IN THE CAR AND GO TRY GETS MORE LIQUOR AND THEN CRASHED INTO A PLACE, AND ALSO THEY'RE GOING TO, A NUMBER OF BARS ARE NOT JUST GOING TO ONE, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE GOING TO BARS AND BARS, BARS.
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO STOP PEOPLE FROM DRINKING ALCOHOL.
IN REGARDS TO THE PEOPLE AND THE BARTENDERS, I WORKED IN THE BAR BUSINESS BACK IN ATLANTA A COUPLE OF DECADES AGO, AND EVERY PLACE I EVER WORKED, YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO DRINK IF YOU'RE WORKING, YOU WOULD BE DOING IT ON THE DOWN LOW.
YOU WOULDN'T BE DRINKING AND THE OWNERS KNOW ABOUT IT.
I FEEL LIKE IT'S PROBABLY LESS COMMON THAN YOU THINK.
I THINK THAT THE GUY MADE A GOOD POINT ABOUT YOU DO HAVE TO TASTE DRINKS.
THERE ARE THINGS LIKE THAT TO HAPPEN SO I JUST THINK THAT PUTTING THE OWNERS ON THE BUSINESSES ISN'T NECESSARILY WISE AND WE DO WANT PEOPLE TO CONTINUE TO COME HERE BECAUSE YOU CAN ONLY SEE THE FORT SO MANY TIMES.
YOU CAN ONLY SEE SOME OF THE HISTORIC THINGS SO MANY TIMES SO THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN NOCATEE AND A BEACH WALK AND SHEAR WATER AND ALL THOSE PLACES.
THEY WANT TO COME DOWN HERE BECAUSE THEY WANT TO GO OUT AND HAVE A GOOD TIME BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE PLACES LIKE THAT UP THERE.
>> THANK YOU. BRUCE MAGUIRE IS MY LAST SPEAKER CARD.
>> HEY, BRUCE MAGUIRE 297 ST. GEORGE STREET.
I DIDN'T MAKE IT TO ALL THE OTHER COMMENTS EXCEPT FROM MARTHA MIKE AND I KNEW WHAT VIRGINIA WAS GOING TO SAY AND I AGREE WITH BOTH OF THEM ABSOLUTELY COMPLETELY.
AFTER HIGH SCHOOL, I WENT TO THE UNIVERSITY OF TAMPA.
I WENT DOWN TO YBOR CITY, VERY POPULAR PLACE TO GO.
AT THAT TIME, YBOR CITY WAS JUST A CASUAL PLACE TO GO, TO HAVE A GOOD TIME AND ENJOY IT.
WHAT HAPPENED THOUGH OVER THE NEXT 20 YEARS AS YBOR CITY HAS BECOME A MASS OF DRINKING PROBLEMS. IF YOU EVER GONE DOWN THERE, TRIED TO GO TO COLUMBIA, YOU WILL SEE YOU CAN'T FIND ANY OPEN SPACE BECAUSE EVERYONE ON THE STREETS DRINKING AND PARTYING ALMOST EVERY NIGHT.
IN TAMPA I WAS DOWN IN KEY WEST, DUVAL STREET.
ANOTHER CITY, LACK THE DISCIPLINE AND THE STRUCTURE TO MAINTAIN ITSELF AND PREVENT FUTURE PROBLEMS. DUVAL STREET HAS NOW BECOME ANOTHER AREA WE'RE DRINKING AND NOISE HAVE TAKEN OVER BECAUSE THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH DISCIPLINE INSTRUCTOR IN THE BEGINNING TO PREVENT IT.
WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T MISCHARACTERIZE OUR CITY AS A DRINKING COMMUNITY LIKE YBOR CITY AND DUVAL STREET, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE GO DOWN THERE TO DRINK AND PARTY.
DO WE WANT PEOPLE TO COME TO ST. AUGUSTINE TO DRINK AND PARTY, OR DO WE WANT TO COME TO ST. AUGUSTINE TO ENJOY WHO WE ARE, OUR CHARACTER, OUR COMMUNITY ARE QUITE MESS.
I ASKED YOU TO DO WHAT MARTHA AND VIRGINIA SAID AND LET'S READDRESS THIS.
>> THANK YOU. I THINK WE HAVE ONE LAST SPEAKER CARD AND I'M GOING TO CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT AFTER THAT.
UNLESS SOMEONE RAISES THEIR HAND.
MS. COLETTE, YOU'RE THE LAST SPEAKER.
>> BJ COLETTE WITH CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE HAS BEEN INTERESTING CITY HERE AND LIST.
REALLY STAND AND LISTEN TO THIS.
IT REALLY DOES CONCERN ME FOR SOMEONE TO GET UP HERE AND SAY, EVEN THOUGH YOU GREW UP HERE AND YOU HAVE CHOSEN OVER THE YEARS TO LIVE DOWNTOWN.
I LIVED DOWNTOWN FOR YEARS AND I MOVED OUT INTO WEST CITY.
WE HAVE PROBLEMS OVER THERE TOO.
THERE'S A LOT OF DRINKING GOING ON OVER THERE TOO.
BUT MY CONCERN IS FOR SOMEONE TO SAY, YOU SHOULD DO EXPECTED DOWNTOWN, EVEN THOUGH YOU'VE LIVED HERE ALL YOUR LIFE, TO KNOW THERE'S GOING TO BE NOISE.
YOU GOT TO PUT UP WITH IT. I JUST CAN'T UNDERSTAND SOMEONE'S SAYING THAT IN A HISTORICAL CITY THAT REALLY CONCERNED ME AND BASICALLY TO THE WHOLE PROBLEM,
[01:55:01]
OUR BASIC PROBLEM, AND WE'VE LISTENED TO IT THIS MORNING, IS THE WORD R-E-S-P-E-C-T.IT'S RESPECT BETWEEN THE BUSINESSES, THE RESIDENTS, AND EVEN THE TOURISTS THAT COME IN TO SCHOOL ACROSS THE STREET, THE COUNTY PEOPLE, EVERYONE IS LOOKING OUT FOR YOURSELF MAINLY AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE HAVING THIS MEETING.
I THINK THE NOISE IS THE BIGGEST PROBLEM THAT YOU NEED TO GET UNDER CONTROL.
THERE'S NOT ENOUGH POLICE WITH THESE MAJORS FOR THE NOISE.
WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT AND TALK ABOUT IT, BUT THERE'S NOT ENOUGH.
IT IS NOT JUST HAPPENING DOWNTOWN.
I WANT TO SAY ON THE RECORD, AFTER LISTENING THE TWO LADIES THAT GOT UP HERE, IT STATED THAT THEY HAD BEEN ATTACKED, AND WE JUST SIT HERE LIKE, THAT'S GOOD TO HEAR.
I DON'T THINK WE TAKE THINGS SERIOUSLY ENOUGH IN THIS CITY ABOUT TREATING EACH OTHER WITH RESPECT. THANK YOU.
>> THAT IS THE END OF PUBLIC COMMENT.
DO WE HAVE FURTHER QUESTIONS OF STAFF ON ISSUES? ANYONE HAVE QUESTIONS FOR STAFF TO CLARIFY?
>> WELL, I'D LIKE TO HAVE A DISCUSSION WOULD YOU LIKE TO GO FIRST?
>> I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE CLARIFICATION FROM STAFF.
I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW THE ACCURATE NUMBERS OF THE EMPLOYEES THAT ARE WORKING BETWEEN 12:00 AND 02:00 FOR HANDLING THOSE COMPLAINTS.
>> CHIEFS MICHELLE, TO COME UP WITH IT.
>> I'M GLAD YOU ASKED THAT BECAUSE I HAVE A QUESTION TO ADD ONTO THAT TOO.
>> HI. GOOD MORNING AGAIN. NORMALLY, WITH A FULL STAFF, NO VACATIONS, NO SICK TIME, NO SCHOOLS.
THEIR ONE SQUAD IS A SERGEANT AND SIX INDIVIDUALS WOULD BE ON AT THAT TIME.
>> CORRECT, THAT'S FOR THE ENTIRE CITY.
>> IN THE RHI HAD SAID THAT IT'S DIFFICULT TO RECRUIT OFFICERS TO WORK THAT PERIOD OF TIME.
>> YES, IT'S THE BIKE UNIT WAS DIFFICULT, BUT RIGHT NOW WE'VE SWITCHED THEIR HOURS A LITTLE BIT TO FOCUS ON SOME OTHER ISSUES WE WERE HAVING.
THE BIKE UNIT WAS OUT UNTIL 2:30, BUT WE HAD TO PULL THEM BACK TO ADJUST SOME OTHER ISSUES THAT WE WERE HAVING AT THE TIME.
WE RAN NUMBERS TO SEE WHEN THE MOST CALLS WERE COMING IN AND WE ADJUST THEIR ISSUES TO ADDRESS THOSE CALLS.
>> MY QUESTION IS, IT'S NOT CLEAR TO ME WHETHER WE'VE ACTUALLY DONE THIS OR NOT.
WE'RE ADDING A ZONE TO DOWNTOWN.
CURRENTLY WE HAVE HOW MANY ZONES AND HOW MANY ARE WE GOING TO HAVE?
>> WE HAVE FOUR PERMANENTLY ZONES AND THAT ZONE THAT YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT, WE HAD ALREADY INCORPORATED THAT.
>> YES, THAT IS THE BIKE UNIT AND THEY'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
BUT WE FOUND WHEN WE RAN THE NUMBERS, WE STILL HAD A LOT OF CALLS COMING IN AT 12:00 PM.
WE HAD TO ADJUST THEIR HOURS A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE THERE WAS THIS GAP WHERE THE DOWNTOWN WAS BEING NEGLECTED DURING THE DAY WHEN THE TOURISTS ARE OUT SHOPPING, THAT THEY WERE FOCUSING JUST ON THE BARS AND SOMETIMES THERE WOULD BE SOME DOWNTIME, SO WHEN WE RAN THE NUMBERS THAT WAS THE BUSIEST TIME IN THAT AREA FOR THEM TO BE OUT 12.
IT DEPENDS ON WHICH DAY IT IS.
THEY WORKED 12-HOUR SHIFTS, SO 12:00 NOON TO MIDNIGHT OR 10:00 AM - 10:00 PM.
BUT THAT'S INTERESTING. THANK YOU.
>> WHAT'S THE COST OF ONE OFFICER? TOTAL COST.
>> GOODNESS. I COULDN'T GIVE YOU THAT OFF HEAD.
>> WE CAN ASK MEREDITH TO COME UP AND ANSWER THAT QUESTION.
FOR AN ENTRY-LEVEL POLICE OFFICER PLUS BENEFITS.
>> DOES THE COST OF ADDING A NEW ZONE IS A WHOLE ANOTHER SEVEN INDIVIDUALS?
>> CORRECT. WE TOOK ONE SERGEANTS POSITION THAT WAS INSIDE AND WE SPLIT UP THOSE DUTIES TO OTHER PEOPLE ONSIDE.
WE PUT SERGEANT BRITTANY GARMEN IS IN CHARGE OF THAT UNIT DOWNTOWN AND WE ADDED ANOTHER FOOT OFFICER AND TWO OTHER BICYCLES TO ASSIST IN THAT AREA.
>> I DIDN'T HAVE IT MEMORIZED, BUT I HAVE IT HERE.
[02:00:04]
SALARY AND BENEFITS INCLUDING PROJECTED OVER TIME, AN ENTRY-LEVEL OFFICER IS ABOUT $78,000.THAT'S PERSONNEL SALARY AND BENEFITS ONLY.
IT'S NOT VEHICLE, WEAPONS, UNIFORMS, AND ALL THOSE.
THAT'S JUST A PERSONAL I CAN CALCULATE THOSE OTHER THINGS AND BRING YOU A NUMBER, BUT THAT'S FOR YOU TO [INAUDIBLE]
>> WE LOOK AT MAYBE 95,000 PER PERSON.
>> I GUESS I GOT TO SUBMIT AND THAT'S ENTRY-LEVEL OF COURSE THERE'S PEOPLE ARE PROMOTED AND HAVE BEEN HERE LONGER THAT NUMBER GOES UP.
>> THIS QUESTION IS FOR MS. SKINNER, PLEASE. THANK YOU, CHIEF.
FOR PUBLIC INFORMATION TO THE BEST OF YOUR ABILITY TO ESTIMATE, WHAT WOULD THE ANNUAL PERMIT COSTS BE, SHOULD THIS ORDINANCE PASS PURPORT AN ESTABLISHMENT?
>> WE HONESTLY HAVE NOT DISCUSSED THAT AT THIS POINT.
WE CANNOT CHARGE ANYTHING THAT WOULD BE MORE THAN AN ADMINISTRATIVE COST FROM WHAT IT COSTS TO ADMINISTER THE PROGRAM.
MOST OF OUR FEES ARE FAIRLY NOMINAL, I WOULD SAY AND WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT CONNECTING THIS PERMIT PROCESS TO THE BUSINESS TAX RECEIPT PROCESS AND THE RENEWAL FOR BUSINESS TAX RECEIPTS.
WE'VE ALSO MENTIONED THAT THERE MAY NOT BE AN ACTUAL FEE.
IT JUST BASICALLY GOING TO BE A PERMANENT APPLICATION THAT IS ASSOCIATED WITH YOUR BUSINESS TAX RECEIPT AND THAT IT TRACKS WITH YOUR BUSINESS TAX RECEIPT.
>> IS IT HUNDREDS, IS IT THOUSANDS? JUST GIVE ME A BALLPARK, PLEASE. IF YOU CAN.
>> I WOULD SAY LESS THAN $50, LESS THAN $100, PROBABLY RANGING BETWEEN 25 AND $100 DEPENDING ON THE HOUR OR TWO, AND THAT IT TAKES FOR STAFF TO PROCESS IT AND MONITOR AND WE WOULD HAVE CO-ENFORCEMENT MONITORING IT.
>> NOT THAT THIS IS SO HELPFUL, BUT BACK WHEN THE CITY MANAGER JOHN REAGAN MET WITH THE INDUSTRY ON MARCH 3RD, 2022.
THEY DISCUSSED THAT AND I BELIEVE THEY WERE TOLD TO $250.
>> AS I SAID, WE HAVE NOT LOOKED INTO THAT.
>> BUT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT HAS TO BE DETERMINED.
>> WHAT'S GOING TO BE FAIR AND JUST COVER THE COST BASICALLY, THE INSPECTION.
>> IF THIS DOES GO BACK TO FIRST HEARING, THEN I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT.
>> WE CAN INSERT A SPECIFIC NUMBER FOR SURE.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE CHIEF BEFORE SHE LEAVES.
DO YOU THINK THAT SINCE THERE'S A LOT OF CONCERN ABOUT THE NOISE AND A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE STRESSED ABOUT HOW THEY HAD TO GO OUT AND HOW THEY CAN'T SLEEP.
DO YOU THINK IF WE MOVE FORWARD AND HIRED TWO MORE POLICE OFFICERS THAT WORK 2-2, WE WILL HAVE A LESS REDUCTION ON THAT.
THEY WILL BE ABLE TO GO OUT AND ASSESS THESE HOMES AND THESE PEOPLE TO PROVIDE A BETTER SERVICE. I'M JUST ASKING.
>> THANK YOU COMMISSIONER. ASSISTANT CHIEF ANTHONY CUTHBERT.
THERE'S A LOT THAT GOES INTO THE ENFORCEMENT OF A NOISE COMPLAINT.
FIRST AND FOREMOST IS THAT WE HAVE TO ACTUALLY HAVE A COMPLAINANT, NOT AN ANONYMOUS CALL.
THE NOISE METER READING HAS TO BE TAKEN FROM THE RECEIVING PARTY, PROPERTY LINE.
WE DO GET A LOT OF ANONYMOUS COMPLAINTS.
THERE IS A NOISE CERTIFICATION PROGRAM THROUGH RUTGERS UNIVERSITY.
LAST YEAR, WE BROUGHT THEM BACK INTO YOU CERTIFY MORE OFFICERS.
WE WOULD LIKE TO KEEP ON DOING THAT.
I'M CURRENTLY WORKING ON A PROGRAM TO GET MORE OFFICERS CERTIFIED.
WE ONLY HAVE TWO NOISE METERS RIGHT NOW, AND THOSE ARE SCIENTIFIC INSTRUMENTS.
THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH CERTIFICATION EVERY YEAR.
WE CAN DEFINITELY IMPROVE ON IF WE HAVE MORE OFFICERS AND MORE TRAINING, WE COULD DO THIS.
BUT A NOISE COMPLAINT, IT DOES TAKE SOME TIME TO INVESTIGATE.
YOU HAVE TO TAKE NUMEROUS READINGS FROM THE SOURCE OF THE NOISE FROM THE RECEIVING PARTY AND WE ALSO HAVE TO TAKE READINGS FROM AN AMBIENT NOISE LEVEL, WHICH MEANS NO NOISE FROM THE SOURCE.
SOMETIMES I TAKES AN HOUR OR TWO TO GET TO THAT POINT.
[02:05:02]
HOPEFULLY THAT ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION.>> I HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION AND I'M NOT SURE WHO ON STAFF COULD ANSWER THIS FOR ME, BUT I HAVE HEARD NUMEROUS PEOPLE SAYING THAT ENFORCEMENT OF OUR EXISTING CODE, NOISE AND OTHER THINGS, OPEN CONTAINERS NEEDS IMPROVEMENT.
IF WE WERE TO MOVE THIS FORWARD AND ACTUALLY ADOPT THIS PROPOSED ORDINANCE, HOW WOULD WE ENFORCE IT?
>> IT WOULD BE A COMBINATION OF POLICE AND CODE ENFORCEMENT.
OBVIOUSLY, THE POLICE WOULD RESPOND TO ANY CALLS FOR ROWDY FOLKS, DRUNK AND DISORDERLY.
THOSE TYPES OF CALLS WOULD ALWAYS GO TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.
I ENVISION A CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICER WOULD BE OUT THERE TO MAKE SURE THAT IF A BAR IS OPEN AFTER MIDNIGHT, THAT THEY DO HAVE THEIR PERMIT AND IF THEY HAVE CONDITIONS PLACED ON THEIR PROPERTY BASED ON A USE BY EXCEPTION THAT THEY'RE ADHERING TO THOSE CONDITIONS.
IT WOULD BE COMBINATION OF POLICE AND CODE ENFORCEMENT.
IT'S HARD TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION IN ADVANCE TO SEE WHAT THE DETAILS OF THE ORDINANCE WOULD BE NOW.
>> GIVEN THE STAFFING AND CODE ENFORCEMENT, I WOULD ASSUME THAT WE WOULD NEED TO INCREASE STAFFING AND CODE ENFORCEMENT.
>> WE'LL POTENTIALLY, IF WE USED OUR CURRENT STAFF LEVEL, THAT WOULD BRING ONE OF OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS AWAY FROM THEIR DUTIES THAT THEY WOULD BE DOING DURING THE DAY.
>> MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT FROM WHEN I HAD ATTENDED AND PARTICIPATED, [NOISE] EXCUSE ME, WITH RESPONSIBLE HOSPITALITY INSTITUTE, IS IT MANY COMMUNITIES THAT TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY DO WANT A VIBRANT NIGHTLIFE, BUT IS ALSO A BALANCED NIGHTLIFE, A WELL-REGULATED NIGHTLIFE AND A SAFE NIGHTLIFE.
DO YOU HAVE NIGHT MANAGERS? THEY HAVE NIGHT MANAGERS THAT ARE A TEAM OF PUBLIC WORKS, CODE ENFORCEMENT, AND LAW ENFORCEMENT, AS WELL AS THE FIRE DEPARTMENT OR FIRST RESPONDERS.
THERE ARE COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS INDUSTRY.
IT'S JUST BEEN BROUGHT UP TO US.
IT JUST OCCURRED TO ME THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE REALLY WERE TRYING TO EMPHASIZE ALL ALONG IS THAT A LOT OF WHAT'S CREATED HERE IS COSTING ALL THE TAXPAYERS ACROSS THE CITY.
I THINK YOU GET THAT, COMMISSIONER SPRINGFIELD, AND I THINK YOU'RE TRYING TO GET THAT.
BUT ANYWAY, IT'S INTERESTING TO NOTE THAT, JUST TO GIVE YOU A TALLY OF, WE'VE HAD 17 SPEAKERS SPEAK, 10 ARE IN FAVOR OF THIS ORDINANCE, SIX ARE OPPOSED OR HAD SUGGESTIONS, AND ONE I TOOK AS NEUTRAL.
OVERALL, I THINK IT'S BEEN GREAT.
>> YEAH, I AGREE. I JUST WANTED TO RECOGNIZE THAT WE DID RECEIVE A PACKET OF PETITION SIGNATURES IN OPPOSITION.
I AM NOT CLEAR ON WHERE THESE PEOPLE LIVE, BUT THAT IS OF LARGE PACKET.
[OVERLAPPING] IT DOESN'T REALLY SAY IT.
IT'S LIKE A CHANGE.ORG PETITION BASED.
I'VE GOT TAMPA, ORLANDO, DENVER, MIAMI, BALTIMORE, CHICAGO.
LOTS OF PEOPLE. NAPLES. MAYBE THESE ARE VISITORS WEIGHING IN.
BUT I HAVE NO COMMENTS OR ADDRESSES.
THERE WERE A LOT OF ST. AUGUSTINE RESIDENTS, BUT WHETHER THAT IS IN THE CITY LIMITS OR NOT, I DON'T KNOW. IT'S HARD TO TELL.
I DON'T HAVE A COPY OF WHAT THEY WERE ASKED TO SIGN.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT WAS THAT THEY WERE TOLD, WHICH WE KNOW THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF MISINFORMATION AND WE'VE REALLY BEEN TRYING VERY HARD TO CLARIFY.
THANK YOU EVERYBODY, THE GIS, AND THE POLICE DEPARTMENT FOR ALL THIS GOOD INFORMATION.
IT'S FAR BEYOND WHAT I EVER EXPECTED.
COMMISSIONERS, WE ARE BEING ASKED, I THINK AT THIS POINT WE HAVE ABOUT 45, 50 MINUTES LEFT OF THE WORKSHOP.
SOME OF US HAVE OTHER WORK TO DO TODAY.
WE HAVE A TDC MEETING, WHICH BY THE WAY, I THINK I DID WANT TO CLARIFY ONE THING.
THE CITY ITSELF, WE DO NOT NECESSARILY PROMOTE THE CITY.
[02:10:02]
IT IS THE STATUTORY RESPONSIBILITY OF THE TOURIST DEVELOPMENT COUNCIL AND THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS TO USE BED TAX TO ADVERTISE THE CITY.THEY ARE THE ONES THAT DO THE ADVERTISEMENT AND PROMOTION OF THE CITY.
IT IS FACTUALLY INCORRECT TO SAY THAT THE CITY IS PROMOTING.
WE DEFINITELY WANT TO SHOW OUR GOOD SIDE.
WE DEFINITELY COOPERATE IN THAT EFFORT.
I SIT ON THE TDC MYSELF REPRESENTING THE CITY.
WE DEFINITELY ARE PRO PUBLIC RELATIONS AND ALL THOSE THINGS.
BUT TO CHARACTERIZE THE CITY AS WE'RE SPENDING THE MONEY TO ATTRACT PEOPLE, YES, WE DO WANT TO ATTRACT PEOPLE, BUT IT IS A STATUTORY RESPONSIBILITY OF THE TOURIST DEVELOPMENT COUNCIL AND THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS TO USE BED TAX FOR ADVERTISING.
THEY HAVE A LOT OF MONEY AND THEY DO A GREAT JOB.
I'LL JUST SAY THAT TO CLARIFY.
ONE OF, I GUESS, REALLY THE MAIN THING THAT WE'RE HERE TO DO IS WEIGH WHAT'S BEEN SAID AND DECIDE IF THIS IS AN ORDINANCE THAT IT'S GOT ENOUGH ABOUT IT GOOD THAT WE THINK THAT WE'RE GOING TO ACCOMPLISH SOME OF THE GOALS THAT I HOPE WE ALL SHARE, BUT HAS SOME AREAS I THINK WE MIGHT AGREE ON THAT NEEDS WORK AND MAYBE WORTH GOING TO TRY TO THE FIRST READING.
TRY AND TAKE A RECOMMENDATIONS, MAYBE SOME OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS AT A FIRST READING AND FURTHER DISCUSSION.
THAT IS THE QUESTION, IF WE TAKE IT FIRST READING FOR FOLKS THAT ARE FOLLOWING ALONG WITH THIS IS REALLY AN OPPORTUNITY TO HEAR AN ORDINANCE AND DISCUSS HERE AT OUR TABLE WHETHER IT'S SOMETHING WORTHY TO MOVE FORWARD FOR PUBLIC HEARING AND DISCUSSION.
THE FIRST READING IS NOT PUBLIC HEARING.
IT DOESN'T HAVE A PUBLIC HEARING COMPONENT.
IT HAS A DISCUSSION COMPONENT WITH BETWEEN THIS TABLE AND STAFF.
SECOND READING IS WHERE WE LISTEN TO THE PUBLIC AND ADJUST POSSIBLY SEND IT BACK, CHANGE, AMEND TABLE, SO FORTH AND SO ON.
WHERE WE ARE NOW IS PRE FIRST READING.
I'M HOPING THAT I CAN GET ENOUGH OF AN AGREEMENT AT THE TABLE THAT WE SHOULD TAKE IT TO FIRST READING.
HERE, MORE ADJUSTMENTS AT FIRST READING, OR MAYBE WE WANT TO MAKE SOME SUGGESTIONS FOR ADJUSTMENTS BEFORE FIRST READING.
WE THINK IT'S GOOD ENOUGH AT FIRST READING TO SEND A PUBLIC HEARING AND HEAR WHAT THE COMMUNITY HAS TO SAY AGAIN.
WE'LL BEGIN WITH, DO WE HAVE ANY VOLUNTEERS? WE HAVE VOLUNTEERS. FROM THIS END OF THE TABLE, [INAUDIBLE].
>> I DO HAVE A COUPLE THINGS TO SAY.
ONE IS THAT WHAT WE'RE HEARING FROM THE CITIZENS IS AND THE BUSINESSES IS THEY WANT US TO ENFORCE PROBLEMS WE HAVE AT NIGHT WITH ORDINANCES THAT WE HAVE CONTROL OVER.
I JUST WANT TO REMIND EVERYBODY AT $90,000 A CLIP, THAT CAN BE A VERY EXPENSIVE VENTURE.
BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE TO ME, IT'S A DEMAND FROM THE PUBLIC AND THE BUSINESSES, BECAUSE WE HAVE BOTH SIDES SAYING THAT WE NEED TO ENFORCE.
I THINK WE NEED TO MAKE A COMMITMENT AS A CITY THAT WE TRY TO DO WHAT WE CAN TO MOVE FORWARD, AND THAT MAY INCLUDE REVISING THE NOISE ORDINANCE, AND TRY TO FIND SOME ALTERNATIVES FOR THE POLICE TO NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH WHAT THEY'RE GOING THROUGH.
WE ALSO NEED TO FOLLOW UP WITH THE RHI RECOMMENDATIONS FOR LIGHTING AND FOR RIDE SHARE.
I ALSO AGREE WITH MR. MARROW, BECAUSE I DID DO THE MATH.
I LOVE DOING THE MATH ON THESE KIND OF THINGS, AND 1.5% OF THE CALLS WERE FROM 12-2% OF ALL THE CALLS IN THE CITY.
IT DOESN'T SEEM OVERWHELMING AT THIS POINT.
BUT THE MORE WE CAN DO TO ENFORCE, THE CALLS WILL GO UP, THE ARREST WILL GO UP, JUST LIKE THEY HAVE WHEN WE STARTED WORKING FOR MORE DUIS.
THAT'S A GOOD THING, BECAUSE ENFORCEMENT IS GOING TO RESULT IN PEOPLE BEING ARRESTED.
IF WE PASS THIS ORDINANCE, BUSINESS IS BEING HELD ACCOUNTABLE.
I THINK IF WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THE ORDINANCE CAREFULLY,
[02:15:04]
WE ALSO HAVE TO TAKE OUR PART AND MOVE FORWARD WITH OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO FOLLOW WHAT WAS SUGGESTED AND APPROVED BY THE COMMISSION PRIOR TO US, AND WHAT THE CITIZENS AND THE BUSINESSES ARE DEMANDING AT THIS POINT THAT WE, AS A CITY, REGARDLESS OF WHO'S PAYING FOR IT, STEP UP AT NIGHT AND PROTECT THE CUSTOMERS AND PROTECT THE RESIDENTS AND PROTECT THE BUSINESS OWNERS FROM THINGS THAT HAPPEN AT NIGHT.I'M NOT OPPOSED TO MOVING FORWARD WITH FIRST READING AT THIS POINT.
>> I HAVE SEVERAL COMMENTS AND JUST WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THESE LOOKED AT.
>> IF WE GO TO FIRST READING AGAIN.
>> FIRST OF ALL, I WANT A CLARIFICATION ON THE ONE TRAINED STAFF MEMBER THAT IS REALLY UNCLEAR AS TO WHETHER THERE IS ONE TRAINED STAFF MEMBER THAT NEEDS TO BE ON-SITE DURING THE HOURS THAT THE ESTABLISHMENT IS OPEN OR THAT THEY CAN HAVE ONE TRAINED STAFF MEMBER THAT'S NEVER THERE, OR BARELY THERE DURING THE DAY OR SOME TIME WHEN THEY'RE CLOSED.
I WANT MORE CLARIFICATION OF THE JUSTIFICATION FOR THE THREE HOLIDAYS' WAIVER AND JUST CLARIFICATION IN GENERAL.
I AGREE THAT THE WEDDING INDUSTRY IS, I'M JUST GOING TO SAY PROBLEMATIC IN A LOT OF WAYS FROM THE SHORT-TERM RENTALS TO THE TRASH, TO THE TO THE INTOXICATION OF GUESTS, AND THEN THOSE GUESTS GOING OUT AND TRYING TO FIND ANOTHER ESTABLISHMENT TO CONTINUE THE PARTY.
THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH HAVING FUN AT A WEDDING.
IT'S JUST THAT WE NEED TO BE MORE RESPONSIBLE, AND DARE I SAY IT I AGREE WITH MISS GLADY AND BE MORE RESPECTFUL OF OUR ENTIRE COMMUNITY.
THAT TRAINING ALSO WOULD ENABLE OR PUT AN EXPECTATION ON EVERY ESTABLISHMENT THAT THAT ESTABLISHMENT WILL BE RESPONSIBLE, THAT IT WILL NOT SERVE INTOXICATED INDIVIDUALS AND CONTINUE TO SERVE THEM.
IT WILL NOT OVER-SERVE INDIVIDUALS.
YOU THINK ABOUT PEOPLE GOING OUT IN THEIR CARS AND DOING DAMAGE TO PHYSICAL STRUCTURES, IT IS A WHOLE LOT WORSE WHEN A WHOLE FAMILY DIES BECAUSE SOMEBODY IS BEHIND THE WHEEL.
THAT SPEAKS TO AS WELL THIS WHOLE RIDES HARES THING.
PERSONALLY, IF I GO OUT AND HAVE A DRINK, I DON'T DRIVE, I GET A LYFT OR AN UBER IS JUST RESPONSIBLE THING TO DO.
WE NEED TO MAKE THAT DELIBERATELY EASIER TO DO THAT.
OVERALL, RESPONSIBLE CROWD MANAGEMENT IS AN IMPORTANT THING TO DO SO WITH THE FIRE DEPARTMENT ON RECOMMENDATIONS.
I ACTUALLY STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS, I SUPPORT ALL OF THOSE.
THEN I JUST WANT TO SAY, THIS IS NOT CLOSING DOWN ANY BUSINESS.
IT IS NOT CAUSING A BUSINESS TO LOSE MONEY, TO ACT RESPONSIBLY AND HAVE THE EXPECTATION TO CONDUCT BUSINESS RESPONSIBLY.
IT IS SIMPLY A PERMIT AND A FAIRLY LOW COST PERMIT.
IT IS TRAINING THAT YOU WOULD WANT TO HAVE ANYWAY IF YOU'RE AN IRRESPONSIBLE ESTABLISHMENT.
IT DOES, IT COULD IF DONE RIGHT, PROVIDE A BALANCE AND OUR COMMUNITY BETWEEN HAVING AN ACTUAL LIVABLE COMMUNITY WHERE PEOPLE CAN LIVE DOWNTOWN.
IT'S NOT DISNEYWORLD WHERE YOU ROLL UP THE STREETS AT NIGHT AND NOBODY IS THERE AT NIGHT.
I LOVE BEING ABLE TO WALK BY MARTHA'S HOUSE AND SHE'S OUT IN HER YARD AND SAYS HIGH, ON MY COMMUTE TO AND FROM WORK IN NORTH CITY TO DOWNTOWN, LIVED IN CITY AND IT NEEDS TO BE RESPECTFUL TO ALL THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE AND WORK AND CONDUCT BUSINESS IN THE CITY.
I THINK THAT IS ALL I HAVE TO SAY.
>> I'M SO SORRY AND I KNEW AS SOON AS I SAID THAT.
IF A BUSINESS DOES NOT COMPLY WITH THE ORDINANCE, THEY GET ANOTHER COUPLE OF CHANCES TO FIX IT.
THEY DON'T GET THEIR PERMANENT REVOKED. THAT'S ALL.
>> WELL, MY TWO PREVIOUS COMMISSIONER SAID QUITE A LOT OF THINGS I WAS GOING TO SAY AND SET UP VERY WELL.
I BELIEVE WE'VE LEARNED A LOT TODAY BESIDES THE LIGHTING THAT WE NEED TO DO.
THERE'S THE TRASH CANS THAT WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH OF.
THERE'S THE RIDE-SHARING THAN MENTIONED, THE OPEN CONTAINER LAWS, WHICH WE REALLY DO NEED TO ENFORCE.
[02:20:03]
THE SOCIAL ALLIANCE? WHAT WAS THAT? THE SOCIAL [OVERLAPPING]>> RESPONSIBLE HOSPITALITY INSTITUTE RECOMMENDED AND NOT A NIGHTLIFE ALLIANCE?
>> I THINK THEY CALLED IT SOCIAL NIGHTLIFE ALLIANCE OR SOMETHING?
>>LET ME GET THE LANGUAGE FOR YOU.
>>ANYWAY I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO SEE THAT TAKE OFF.
I'D LIKE TO SEE US SUPPORT THAT IN ANY WAY THAT WE CAN TO MAYBE HAVE MEETINGS WITH PEOPLE THAT ARE IN THIS BUSINESS TO SEE HOW WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO HELP THAT.
>> IT'S THE SOCIAL ECONOMIC ALLIANCE AND IT INCLUDED BUSINESS OWNERS, CITY EMPLOYEES, CITIZENS.
IT WASN'T JUST A BUSINESS COMMITTEE, IT WAS A MIXED COMMITTEE.
>>IT WAS ASKED TO BE SEVEN REPRESENTATIVES TO BEGIN A WORKING GROUP.
>> I THINK THAT WAS A GREAT SUGGESTION AND I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT HAPPEN.
>> WELL, I WANT TO GIVE A SHOUT OUT TO BJ IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO SIT HERE AND HEAR PEOPLE SAYING THAT THEY WERE ATTACKED ON THEIR PROPERTY.
IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO HEAR THAT PEOPLE DON'T FEEL SAFE IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LEAVING THE BARS USING THE BATHROOM IN THEIR YARDS AND WE HEARD SOME OF THAT AT THE LAST MEETING.
IT'S NOT A GOOD THING TO DEFINITELY NOT BE ABLE TO SLEEP.
BECAUSE SLEEP IS ESSENTIAL IS WHEN OUR BODY IS RECHARGE SO THAT WE CAN KEEP ON LIVING.
THE NOISE DEFINITELY NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED THAT'S WHY I ASKED ABOUT THE POLICE AND THE TIMING THAT THEY ARE OUT THERE SO THAT THEY CAN CHECK THE NOISE SO PEOPLE CAN GO TO SLEEP.
THE ONE LADY I WROTE A LOT OF PEOPLE'S NAMES DOWN AND SOME OF THEM, I LIKE WHAT THE LADY SAID ABOUT THE GIGGLING GATORS JACKIE HEARD ABOUT THE DRUGS AND THE NOISE AND PEOPLE POCKETING AND HER PROPERTY AND HOW SHE HAD TO GO OUT AND DO THAT.
I THINK THERE'S A NEED FOR SOME STRUCTURE.
I THINK THAT WE HAVE ALREADY ESTABLISHED THAT WE ARE NOT TRYING TO CHANGE HOURS FOR MANY ESTABLISHMENT.
LIGHTING IS VERY IMPORTANT PEOPLE REALLY DON'T REALIZE HOW IMPORTANT LIGHTING IS.
LIGHTING PREVENT STAFF, LIGHTING, PREVENT SAFETY.
YOU CAN SEE WHERE YOU'RE GOING AND YOU CAN SEE IF THERE'S DANGER LURKING.
WE DEFINITELY HAVE TO DO BETTER AND LIGHTING IN OUR CITY AS FAR AS GETTING LIGHTS.
I HAVE BEEN PUSHING REALLY HARD FOR THE WEST SIDE TO GET LIGHTING BECAUSE IT'S A SAFETY FACTOR.
THAT'S JUST LIKE DRIVING DOWN THESE DARK HIGHWAYS.
SOME OF THAT IS CAUSED BY PEOPLE THAT COMMUTE AND SO FORTH.
BUT I THINK THAT AS FAR AS THE CROWD MANAGER ISN'T EXISTENCE BECAUSE WHEN I WAS ON THE SPECIAL EVENTS COMMITTEE, WE ALWAYS THE FIRE MARSHAL ALWAYS SPOKE OF THAT FOR CROWDS.
THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS ESSENTIAL TO HAPPEN IN A BAR BECAUSE AS YOU SEE AT CONCERTS OR ANYTHING, IS SOMETHING STRANGE NOISE HAPPENS OR GUNSHOT, THERE HAS TO BE SOMEBODY THAT'S TRAINED TO CONTAIN THAT CROWD AND GET EVERYBODY OUT OF THERE AS SAFELY AS POSSIBLE.
THAT IS VERY ESSENTIAL THAT WE NEED TO HAVE THAT.
I THINK EVERY PLACE NICE SECURITY BUT TO BE ABLE TO POLICE HOW KNOWING HOW MUCH SOMEBODY CAN DRINK, IT'S GOING TO BE VERY DIFFICULT TO SAY HOW MUCH SOMEBODY CAN DRINK.
SOME PEOPLE CAN DRINK ONE DRINK AND BE TORE UP.
SOME PEOPLE CAN DRINK 12 DRINKS AND IT NOT AFFECT THEM.
THAT'S GOING TO BE VERY DIFFICULT FOR A BARTENDER OR ANYONE TO DETERMINE THAT.
I DID HERE THE VICE MAYOR, WHEN SHE POINTED OUT THAT GUNS CAN RUN RAMPANT IN OUR COMMUNITY, THAT OUR GOVERNOR HAS TAKEN AWAY GETTING A PERMIT TO CARRY THAT IS DANGEROUS.
THAT IS DANGEROUS WHETHER YOU'RE IN A BAR IN YOUR HOME,
[02:25:01]
ANYWHERE, THERE'S SOMEBODY CAN JUST HAVE A GUN AND OPEN FIRE.WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO, AS A COMMUNITY, WORK TOGETHER TO MAKE SURE OUR STREETS ARE SAFER.
WHETHER IT'S THE BAR, WHETHER IT'S YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO BRING A SENSE OF WHERE THE HOME RULE COMES.
WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE OUR CITY IS A SAFE PLACE.
REGARDLESS OF THE TOURISTS, REGARDLESS OF BARS, RESTAURANTS, HOTELS, WHATEVER, WE HAVE TO START CARING ABOUT OUR NEIGHBORS, SEEING WHAT'S GOING ON IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.
IT ALL STARTS WITH ALL OF US FOR A BETTER COMMUNITY. THANK YOU.
>> THEN JUST A COUPLE SIDE NOTES IT REALLY WORRIES ME WHEN I HEAR A BAR OWNER COME FORWARD AND SAY THAT PEOPLE ARE WALKING INTO THEIR VENUE WITH OPEN DRINKS AND I HAVE TO ASK THE QUESTION.
WHO LET THEM OUT OF THEIR VENUE WITH A DRINK IN THEIR HAND? HOW DID THEY GET OUT? I JUST WANT TO ARGUE THAT WE HAVE, AND I'M SURE THERE'S AN EXPLANATION AND I'M SURE THAT I'LL HEAR IT NOW, BUT IT DOES WORRY ME WHEN I HEAR THAT FROM A BAR OWNER'S MOUTH.
IT WORRIES ME WHEN I HEAR SOMEONE IN THE INDUSTRY SAY PEOPLE COME HERE TO PARTY.
THAT MAKES ME SAD IN A WAY TOO BECAUSE I'VE SEEN JUST LIKE EVERYONE IN THIS ROOM PROBABLY WHO'S BEEN HERE ANY LENGTH OF TIME, THIS TOWN HAS CHANGED VERY MUCH AND THIS IS WHAT WE'RE STRUGGLING WITH NOW, IS THE NEW NORMAL.
I APPRECIATE THAT EVERYONE HERE, IT SOUNDS LIKE EVERYONE HERE SUPPORTS MOVING IT TO THE FIRST READING, BUT MY QUESTION WOULD BE, ARE THERE CHANGES NOW THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE HAPPEN BEFORE WE GO TO THE FIRST READING? I'M ASKING THE CITY ATTORNEY OUR PROCESS HERE.
>> WELL, THAT WOULD BE CERTAINLY HELPFUL TO YOUR STAFF.
WE TRY AND DECIPHER FROM THE COMMENTS WHERE WE THINK THERE'S COALESCENCE ON ANY CHANGES.
I THINK I HEARD DIFFERING THINGS ABOUT NOISE THOUGH, AND I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE, I KNOW WHAT I'M BEING TOLD TO WRITE.
I THINK I HEARD EVERYTHING FROM, REMOVE NOISE COMPLETELY FROM THIS ORDINANCE AND JUST FOCUS ON BETTER STAFFING, BETTER ENFORCEMENT OF OUR EXISTING NOISE ORDINANCE, WHICH HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS ORDINANCE, IT'S A SEPARATE SECTION OF OUR CODE.
I WOULD POINT OUT THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO HAVE LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS ENFORCE THE NOISE ORDINANCE.
THE WAY OUR NOISE ORDINANCE IS WRITTEN, IT PROVIDES THAT ANY NOISE CONTROL OFFICER, SO THAT WOULD BE SOMEONE TRAINED, IT COULD BE A CODE ENFORCEMENT OFFICER THAT'S RECEIVED THE TRAINING AND HAS THE PROPER DECIBEL METER, THEY ARE NOT ENFORCED CRIMINALLY.
THOSE ARE CIVIL CITATIONS, SO IT DOESN'T REQUIRE THAT A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER DO THAT PARTICULAR TASK.
HISTORICALLY, THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS BECAUSE THE ONLY FOLK IN OUR CITY STAFF THAT ARE AROUND LATE AT NIGHT TEND TO BE LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS.
THEY'RE THE ONES WHO ARE DOING THE ENFORCEMENT, BUT IT NEED NOT BE THAT WAY PER OUR EXISTING NOISE ORDINANCE BECAUSE IT IS A CIVIL CITATION.
>> I HAVE A QUESTION RELATED TO THAT.
ONE OF THE CONCERNS OF THE BUSINESSES ARE THAT THIS ORDINANCE WOULD ALLOW THE CITY TO CLOSE THEM DOWN FOR A PERIOD OF TIME.
CAN WE CURRENTLY CLOSE DOWN A BUSINESS BECAUSE OF A SOUND ORDINANCE VIOLATION?
>> NO, AND THAT'S ANOTHER THING I NEEDED TO EXPLAIN BECAUSE I THINK THERE'S [OVERLAPPING] DIFFERING LEVELS OF UNDERSTANDING ON WHAT CODE ENFORCEMENT CAN BE.
YOU HAVE CODE ENFORCEMENT THAT'S DONE THROUGH COUNTY COURT, SO THAT PROCESS IS COMPLETELY SEPARATE FROM YOUR CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD, SEPARATE FROM A SPECIAL MAGISTRATE.
THEY CAN BE CIVIL CITATIONS LIKE NOISE ORDINANCE VIOLATIONS OR CIVIL CITATION, YOU GO BEFORE A COUNTY COURT JUDGE.
THEY CAN BE CRIMINAL CITATIONS.
FOR INSTANCE, DRINKING IN PUBLIC, URINATING IN PUBLIC, CAMPING IN PUBLIC, ARE ALL CRIMINAL CITATIONS, AND I CAN ASSURE THE GENTLEMAN WHO WAS IN THE AUDIENCE THAT WE DO ENFORCE IT.
IF YOU'D LIKE TO SEE THE DATA ON OUR ENFORCEMENT, IT'S ACTUALLY ON THE CITY ATTORNEYS' WEBPAGE.
QUARTERLY AND ANNUALLY WE HAVE TO STAFF FIRST APPEARANCE IN CRIMINAL COURT ON THOSE MATTERS WHEN
[02:30:01]
SOMEONE IS ARRESTED AND WE DO EVERY SINGLE WEEK.THURSDAYS ARE CRIMINAL COURT CITATIONS FOR DRINKING IN PUBLIC, URINATING IN PUBLIC, CAMPING IN PUBLIC, ALL OF THOSE THINGS ARE ENFORCED EVERY SINGLE WEEK, HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS OF CASES.
DO WE CATCH EVERYBODY? NO. THAT'S MUCH LIKE SPEEDING.
YOU WILL ONLY CATCH A CERTAIN NUMBER OF FOLKS WHO ARE SPEEDING, NOT EVERYONE.
THAT'S ONE BUNDLE IS THINGS THAT GO TO COUNTY COURT.
SEPARATE BUNDLE IS YOUR CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD, YOUR CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD, CHAPTER 162, TYPE CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD.
THOSE ARE LIENS ON THE PROPERTY.
SO SOMEONE DOES SOMETHING THAT VIOLATES THE CODE ON THEIR PRIVATE PROPERTY AND THE ENFORCEMENT PROCESS THROUGH THAT TYPE OF CODE ENFORCEMENT IS TO GO TO THE CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD, OR THEORETICALLY A SPECIAL MAGISTRATE, AND THE PUNISHMENT, SO TO SPEAK, IS A LIEN ON THE PROPERTY.
SO IT'S A FINE THAT'S LIENABLE ON THE PROPERTY.
THEN THERE'S THIS PARTICULAR PROCESS THAT'S IN THIS MAYBE DRAFT ORDINANCE WHICH WOULD SET UP A DIFFERENT PROCESS WHERE INSTEAD OF IT BEING STRICTLY CODE ENFORCEMENT BOARD CHAPTER 162 TYPE FINE ON THE PROPERTY, IT WOULD BE A PROCESS BEFORE A SPECIAL MAGISTRATE AND THE PUNISHMENT OR THE PENALTY IS POTENTIALLY ULTIMATELY LOSING YOUR AFTER-HOURS PERMIT.
SO IT'S THREE BUCKETS IF YOU CAN VISUALIZE IT THAT WAY.
>> VERY INTERESTING. I THINK THAT WE'VE GOT A TO-DO LIST HERE, NO THEY WERE SURPRISED.
>> I WOULD JUST WANT TO SAY THIS ABOUT THE NOISE PORTION OF THE ORDINANCE.
BEFORE I WALKED IN I WAS HERE ON IT.
HOWEVER, NOW THAT I'VE HEARD PUBLIC TESTIMONY ABOUT IT AND HOW MUCH IT IMPACTS OTHER BUSINESSES AS WELL AS RESIDENTS, WE'VE BEEN SAYING IT'S IMPACTING RESIDENTS AND WE WANT TO BE A LIVABLE CITY, BUT WE'VE GOT A BUSINESS WHO IS IN THE SLEEPING BUSINESS AND WE DO HAVE PEOPLE NOT JUST LIVING BUT SLEEPING IN DOWNTOWN THAT ARE LOSING MONEY AS A RESULT OF THIS.
SO I DO THINK I'D LIKE TO SEE IT STAY AT LEAST THROUGH FIRST READING AND SEE IF WE CAN MAYBE TAKE THE TIME TO WORK ON IT.
SO I'M FALLING ON THE SIDE OF KEEPING IT IN THERE AND MAYBE DISCUSSING OPTIONS AROUND THAT.
SO YES, I INTERRUPTED OR YOU HAD [OVERLAPPING]
>> I WAS JUST GOING TO ASK BUT, OUR ATTORNEY'S QUESTION WAS, HOW DO WE FEEL ABOUT THE NOISE ORDINANCE BEING IN THERE AND THEN, I THINK WE MUST HAVE NOW OUR SUPPORT OF INCLUDING IT.
>> I ECHO THAT. I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO SEE IT IN THERE, AT LEAST THROUGH FIRST READING.
>> SO WE CAN DIG DOWN A LITTLE BIT DEEPER.
IN FACT, I THINK THE WAY IT IS, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE PROVISION TO BE ADDED THAT WOULD ALLOW THE WAIVER OF REQUIREMENTS UP TO THREE TIMES A YEAR FOR VENUES AND I THINK WHAT COMES TO MIND HERE, AS I HAD REMEMBERED THAT SOMETIMES THE LIGHTHOUSE MUSEUM DOES A MOON TOUR OR SOMETHING ALONG THE LINES AND THEY DIDN'T WANT TO HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE PERMIT PROCESS.
BUT IT'S A FUNDRAISER THAT THEY DO SO MANY TIMES A YEAR.
SO THAT YOU CAN GO ONTO THE TOP OF THE TOWER AND THEY DOES SERVE WINE OR CHAMPAGNE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, AND THEY WOULD LIKE TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT AND THAT'S KIND OF AN ESCAPE CLAUSE AS WELL AS FOR VENUES THAT WANT TO JUST DO NEW YEAR'S EVE OR JUST WANT TO DO 4TH OF JULY.
THAT WAS REASONING THAT STAFF HAS THAT HERE, AS IN RECOMMENDATION.
>> MADAM MAYOR, DID YOU SAY SEVERAL TIMES A YEAR FOR THE MOON THING OR 70?
THE SUGGESTED LANGUAGE IS A WAIVER OF THREE TIMES A YEAR.
>> RIGHT. I WAS TALKING ABOUT THE LIGHTHOUSE.
>> NO. I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T KNOW HOW OFTEN THEY DO IT.
I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY TIMES THEY DO IT AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR HOURS ARE, BUT I DO RECALL THAT BEING PART,
[02:35:02]
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS BROUGHT UP TO US IS [NOISE] HOW DO YOU LET THE ONES THAT DON'T REGULARLY SERVE ALCOHOL BUT WANT TO DO A SPECIAL EVENT AND STAY OPEN A LITTLE BIT LONGER THAN THEY KNOW.THERE'S RESTAURANTS IN A LOT OF PLACES.
OBVIOUSLY THERE'S ONLY 27 OR THE LATE NIGHT HOUR PLACES OUT OF 188, SO THERE'S ALL A LOT OF OTHER VENUES THAT MAY WISH TO DO NEW YEAR'S EVE, THAT'S A RESTAURANT. DOES THAT HELP?
>> I WOULD WANT TO SEE LANGUAGE ADDED THAT DOES STATE CLEARLY THAT BUSINESS CAN STAY OPEN AND OPERATE AFTER 12:00 AM, BUT WOULD NEED THE PERMIT IF THEY WISH TO SELL ALCOHOL.
TO MAKE THAT VERY CLEAR IN THE CODE OR EVEN IN THE WHEREAS THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT.
AS FAR AS BUSINESSES BEING RESPONSIBLE FOR THE BEHAVIOR OUTSIDE OF THEIR ESTABLISHMENTS, I DO AGREE WITH STAFF THAT THAT EITHER NEEDS TO BE REVISED OR CLARIFIED, AND I WOULD LOOK TO ANY SUGGESTIONS BEING MADE AS TO HOW TO STILL HOLD ESTABLISHMENTS RESPONSIBLE IF SOMETHING BEGINS THERE AND SPILLS OUT INTO THE STREETS.
BUT I REALLY UNDERSTAND WHERE THEY'RE COMING FROM WHEN THEY SAY HOW ARE YOU GOING TO ENFORCE THIS? HOW ARE YOU GOING TO HOLD US RESPONSIBLE FOR THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING OUTSIDE OF OUR PREMISES? FOR EXAMPLE, IN THE ALLEY BEHIND BRITISH PUB. THERE YOU GO.
>> I'M SURE THAT IF THEY KNEW WHAT WAS GOING TO ESCALATE TO WHAT HAPPENED OUT THERE, THEY WOULD HAVE CALLED THE POLICE.
SOMEBODY CAN PLAY LIKE IT SETTLES AND THEN GO OUTSIDE AND ACT UP, WHICH APPARENTLY HAPPENED WITH THE GUY.
>> YEAH. IT KEEPS HAPPENING. LET'S SEE.
I WOULD LIKE TO LOOK AND RE-EXAMINE THE PENALTIES AND LOOK A LITTLE BIT CLOSER AND I WOULD ASK THE CITY ATTORNEY TO LOOK AT THAT CLOSELY AS WELL, THE PENALTIES, JUST TO SEE IF THERE'S ANY CLEANUP THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE ON DEFINITIONS, AND I CAN TALK OFFLINE WITH THAT.
>> MY EXPECTATION WAS THAT IF WE GOT SOME CONSENSUS THAT I WOULD DO SOME WORDSMITHING ON THAT, TIGHTEN UP CROSS DEFINITIONS AND SO ON.
WE JUST WANTED TO KNOW WHERE YOU WANTED US TO GO.
WE APPRECIATE IT. I THINK WE'RE GOOD.
I THINK EVERYONE'S HEARD UNLESS ANYONE WANTS TO ADD ANYTHING MORE, I THINK WE'RE DOING REALLY GOOD.
IT'S 20 MINUTES TO NOON. COMMISSIONER SPRINGFIELD.
>> WELL, I JUST WANT TO THANK EVERYBODY AGAIN.
THANK THE STAFF AGAIN FOR THE DATA AND THANK EVERYBODY FOR COMING AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR INPUT.
I'M NOT A 12 TO TWO O'CLOCK BAR HOPPER, WE DON'T KNOW AND WE ONLY KNOW WHEN YOU TELL US AND WE ONLY KNOW WHEN WE HAVE THE DATA.
I REALLY APPRECIATE HAVING THAT AND I LOVED THE CONVERSATIONS I'VE HAD WITH PEOPLE.
I LOOK FORWARD TO JASON'S CAMPAIGN.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS IMPRESSIVE IN THE RHI WAS THE AMPHITHEATER WHO SERVED ALCOHOL HAS A REALLY GOOD PROCESS THAT THEY HAVE DEVELOPED THEMSELVES AS A BUSINESS TO CONTROL THEIR CLIENTS.
I WOULD HOPE THAT SOME OF THE BUSINESSES HERE WOULD TAKE IT ON THEMSELVES TO WATCH THAT AND TO LOOK INTO IT FOR THEMSELVES.
>> INTERESTING. I WOULD LIKE TO SAY I DO THINK THAT WE'RE GOING TO MOVE FORWARD ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
I THINK WE'LL GET SUPPORT FOR MOVING IT TO FIRST READING.
HOWEVER, I WOULD ASK MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS, I KNOW COMMISSIONER BLONDER HAS DONE THIS.
SINCE YOU MENTIONED THAT WE'RE NOT OUT THAT LATE, WHICH IS NOT ALWAYS TRUE.
SOMETIMES WE JUST STAY UP THAT LATE, BUT IF WE HAVE A WEDDING TO GO TO.
BUT I WOULD ENCOURAGE EVERYONE AND THE COMMISSIONERS TO
[02:40:02]
DO A RIDE ALONG WITH CHIEF OR WHOEVER'S ASSIGNED.I'VE ALWAYS ENCOURAGED COMMISSIONERS TO DO A RIDE ALONG.
I PERSONALLY HAVE DONE ONE UP UNTIL THE MIDNIGHT HOUR AND THEN YOU CAN SEE HOW THE CITY CHANGES UP UNTIL MIDNIGHT, ESPECIALLY FOR 10 TO MIDNIGHT AND THEN FROM MIDNIGHT TO 2:30.
I KNOW IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A WORK AND A CHANGE OF SCHEDULE, AND IT CERTAINLY IS FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AS WELL, BUT I THINK IT'S SO USEFUL TO ACTUALLY SEE WHAT'S GOING ON IN YOUR CITY.
I ACTUALLY HAVE BEEN DOWN WITHOUT A RIDE ALONG ON MY OWN AND NOT PARTICIPATING, WORKING, GOING DOWN AND LOOKING AT THE LIGHTING, LOOKING AT HOW THE RIDESHARE WORKS.
IN FACT, RUBEN FRANKLIN AND I TRAVELED TO ORLANDO TO TAKE A LOOK AT HOW DOES ORLANDO DO THE RIDESHARE AT THE END OF THE EVENING? THERE'S SOME REALLY GOOD IDEAS AND I REALLY APPRECIATE YOU BRINGING THAT UP.
IS ANYONE INTERESTED IN MAKING A MOTION OR YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO MAKE THE MOTION? THAT IS FINE.
I MOVE THAT WE TAKE THESE ORDINANCES PROPOSED WITH SOME OF THE CHANGES TO FIRST READING AND GO FROM THERE.
>> OKAY. MADAM CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL.
THANK YOU FOR EVERYONE THAT CAME.
I APPRECIATE YOUR PATIENCE AND PARTICIPATION AND I CONTINUE TO ASK YOU TO CONTINUE TO STAY ENGAGED. WE ARE ADJOURNED.
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.