>> CALL ROLE. [00:00:01] >> NANCY SIKES-KLINE. [CALL TO ORDER] >> HERE. >> ROXANNE HORVATH. >> HERE. >> BARBARA BLONDER. >> HERE. >> CYNTHIA GARRIS. JIM SPRINGFIELD. >> HERE. >> TODAY, WE HAVE PASTOR DR. GARY WILLIAMS WITH THE HOPEWELL CHURCH. WE ASK HIM TO COME FORWARD FOR THE INVOCATION. PLEASE STAND. [NOISE] AFTER THE INVOCATION, WE'LL HAVE THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE LED BY VICE MAYOR ROXANNE HORVATH. >> LET'S PRAY. FATHER, WE THANK YOU FOR THIS PRIVILEGE TO BE ABLE TO GATHER TOGETHER AND TO HANDLE THE BUSINESS THAT IS AT HAND. WE PRAY FOR THIS COUNCIL. WE ASK YOUR WISDOM TO REST STRONG ON THEM. BLESS THEM WITH THE ACUMEN TO MAKE THE RIGHT DECISIONS, THE RIGHT CHOICES. GIVE THEM THE COURAGE AND THE FORTITUDE TO WEATHER THROUGH THOSE ISSUES THAT ARE NOT AS SIMPLE AND NOT AS PLAIN. BLESS THEM TO REPRESENT OUR COMMUNITY EXTREMELY WELL, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT SOMEONE IS POOR OR AFFLUENT. WE THANK YOU BECAUSE YOU HAVE ESTABLISHED GOVERNMENT AND THAT YOU HAVE BLESSED US WITH PEOPLE WHO HAVE OFFERED THEMSELVES UP FOR SERVICE, WHICH IS A NOBLE EFFORT FOR OUR COMMUNITY. WE THANK YOU FOR THIS DAY. WE THANK YOU FOR ALL THAT YOU HAVE DONE FOR US. IT IS OUR PRAYER THAT YOU WILL CONTINUE TO BLESS US, THAT EVEN IN THOSE MOMENTS WHERE WE DISAGREE, MAY THERE NOT BE A SPIRIT THAT IS DISAGREEING. [NOISE] BLESS US AND KEEP US. THAT IS OUR PRAYER. WE SEAL THIS PRAYER. IN THE NAME OF CHRIST JESUS, WE PRAY. AMEN. >> AMEN. >> [NOISE] PLEASE JOIN US IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE. >> I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. >> PLEASE BE SEATED. [NOISE] BEFORE I GO INTO MODIFICATION AND APPROVAL OF REGULAR AGENDA, [2. ADMINISTRATIVE ITEMS] [INAUDIBLE] I BELIEVE, YOU HAVE AN ADDITION OR A CHANGE? >> YES, WE DO. WE HAVE A PROPOSED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT REGARDING THE SA MARINA LITIGATION, THE FEDERAL AND THE STATE LITIGATION. COPIES OF THE PROPOSED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT ARE IN THE BACK OF THE ROOM FOR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC AND WE WOULD REQUEST THAT WE PLACE IT IMMEDIATELY AFTER ITEM 4, PUBLIC COMMENTS FOR GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENTS ON THE AGENDA, SO ESSENTIALLY A 4B, IF YOU LIKE. I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE RESERVE A SEPARATE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD FOR THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT. >> WE HAVE A SUGGESTION, WE ADD SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT [NOISE] DISCUSSIONS AS ITEM 4B, DO WE HAVE SPECIAL COMMENT? DO WE HAVE A MOTION? >> I PROPOSE THE MOTION. >> OKAY. >> SECOND. >> ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE SETTLEMENT, SAY AYE. >> AYE. >> PROPOSED. [INAUDIBLE] MODIFIED. WE WILL HAVE NO [INAUDIBLE] PRESENTATIONS, RECOGNITION FOR PERMISSIONS TONIGHT. WE DO HAVE RECEIVED CARDS FOR A COUPLE OF COMMENT. [4. PUBLIC COMMENTS FOR GENERAL PUBLIC COMMENTS OR FOR AGENDA ITEMS NOT REQUIRING A SEPARATE PUBLIC HEARING] I WILL ASK MR. RICK SPENCE [INAUDIBLE]. [NOISE] THANK YOU, BILL. >> WE CAN'T HEAR YOU VERY WELL BACK THERE, BY THE WAY. I'M NOT SURE WHETHER YOU CAN TURN THE VOLUME UP. >> I WILL. SOME OTHER DAYS, I HAVE TO [INAUDIBLE]. >> I'M RICK SPENCE. SOME OF YOU KNOW ME, I'M THE TREASURER OF LINCOLNVILLE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION. I'M JUST HERE AGAIN TO ASK YOU WHERE WE ARE WITH REGARD TO [INAUDIBLE] PARK. I KNOW IT'S A PAIN IN THE NECK, BUT WE TALKED ABOUT [INAUDIBLE] DOG PARK, TENNIS COURT BEING RESURFACED BY THE COUNTY. I JUST WONDERED WHERE WE WERE WITH THAT, THAT'S THE FIRST THING. SECONDLY, WE MET WITH JAIME PERKINS FROM THE LCRA. SHE INFORMED US THAT THE CITY WAS NOT GOING TO APPLY FOR A GRANT, WOULD FUND SOME OF THIS, BECAUSE IT WILL BE A COMPETING INTEREST WITH THE COUNTY APPLYING FOR THE SAME GRANT. I'M NOT SURE HOW ACCURATE THAT IS, BUT THAT [NOISE] WAS WHAT WAS RELAYED TO US AS THE PART OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION. WE'D LIKE TO SEE THE PARK MOVING FORWARD BECAUSE MONEY IS THERE. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT'S ON EVERYONE'S RADAR. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. THE NEXT NAME ON THE SPEAKER CARD HAS MS. MAUREEN LONG. MS. LONG? [BACKGROUND] PLEASE [INAUDIBLE]. [00:05:01] >> MAUREEN LONG, 1821 MENENDEZ PARK, ST. AUGUSTINE, FLORIDA. IS THAT RIGHT NOW, THE PICTURE? >> YES. >> DO YOU SEE IT? >> WOULD YOU PUT THE MICROPHONE UP A LITTLE BIT CLOSER? >> YES. YOUR PICTURE IS NOT UPSIDE DOWN? >> WE DON'T HAVE A PICTURE. >> HOW DO I DO THIS? I'M SORRY. >> MARY, IF WE COULD HAVE THE AV SHOWING A BIT? THERE WE GO. >> IT'S UPSIDE DOWN. >> NOW, I'M THERE. I'M SORRY SO MUCH. FISH ISLAND ARCHAEOLOGICAL SITE WALKING TOUR, WHICH WAS LED BY ARCHAEOLOGIST MARSHA CHANCE AND BIOLOGIST J.B. MILLER BACK IN OCTOBER OF 2020. THEY USED A KEY AND A MAP. [NOISE] THEY USED WHEN THEY WERE GIVING THE SITE. THEY USE THESE KEYS BECAUSE THESE WERE IMPORTANT KEYS TO SHOW WHERE THE AREAS ARE, BUT NONE OF THESE ARCHAEOLOGICAL, HISTORICAL FEATURES CAN BE FOUND ON ANY OF THE EDUCATIONAL INTERPRETIVE PANELS THAT'S PROPOSED AT FISH ISLAND PRESERVE. I'M HERE TO REQUEST THAT AN ADDITIONAL EDUCATIONAL INTERPRETIVE PANEL BE ADDED; ONE THAT WILL INCLUDE EL VERGEL'S ARCHAEOLOGICAL IMPORTANCE, TELL ABOUT THE REMAINS OF THE MAIN HOUSE WELL, WHERE THE CHANNEL IS, WHY AND HOW IT WAS USED. THERE IS GOOD INFORMATION ON WHERE THESE REMAINS ARE. THIS IS OUR HISTORY. JUST AS CHERISHED AS IT IS IN THE [INAUDIBLE] CITY, THIS ISLAND'S HISTORY AND REMAINS ARE EQUALLY IMPORTANT. WE HAVE A PANEL THAT'S PROPOSED ON JESSE FISH, THE ORANGE BARON, BUT IT REALLY DOESN'T EXPLAIN WHY HE WAS ORANGE BARON. HE WAS THE OWNER OF THE COMMERCIAL ORANGE GROVES BACK AT FLORIDA, IN 1748, GERMINATING AN INDUSTRY THAT WOULD BECOME AN ECONOMIC DRIVER AND IMMORTALIZED THE ICONIC FRUIT AS A SYMBOL OF BIRTH STATE. HE WENT ABOVE AND BEYOND AND CREATED A SUCCESSFUL METHOD OF PICKING, DRYING AND WRAPPING FRUIT IN A COMMERCIAL VENTURE ICONIC OF FLORIDA. WE ASK AND WE ARE LUCKY TO HAVE J.B. MILLER AS THE LAND MANAGER FOR THE FISH ISLAND PRESERVE. HE RESPECTS THE LAND AND LOVES IT JUST AS WE DO. HE'S KNOWLEDGEABLE AND DILIGENT JUST AS THE CITY STAFF ARE. THEY'RE HARDWORKING AND WE REALIZED WHAT A TOUGH JOB THEY HAVE BALANCING ALL THAT THEY DO DAILY. BUT I ASK IF WE COULD GO BACK AND EXPAND ON JESSE FISH'S PANEL, ALONG WITH ADDING A PANEL FOR EL VERGEL'S ARCHAEOLOGICAL REMAINS AND THEIR IMPORTANCE. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, MS. LONG. [NOISE] OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS HENRY HALL. [NOISE] MR. HALL? >> IS THIS MICROPHONE [INAUDIBLE] MUTE? MY NAME IS HENRY HALL. I LIVE IN 41 VALENCIA STREET. I'M HERE AS A CONCERNED CITIZEN TO SPEAK ABOUT THE BRIDGE REPLACEMENT ON KING STREET. I KNOW THAT THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE WHO ARE KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THIS, BUT THERE'S AN AWFUL LOT THAT ARE NOT. THIS IS A BIG DEAL. I DO NOT WANT TO SAY ON STRATTON, BUT I JUST WANT TO POINT OUT [NOISE] THAT THAT BRIDGE FEEDS ONE CONTINUOUS LINE GOING NORTH OFF THE US 1. IT FEEDS THE EASTBOUND COMING OFF OF WEST KING. IT HAS A LITTLE BIT OF TRAFFIC COMING FROM THE SOUTH ON US 1 THAT TURNS LEFT AND IT'S GOT TWO LEFT TURN LANES GOING ONTO US 1, GOING SOUTH. I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THE HOSPITAL, ALL THE MEDICAL OFFICES, ALL THE SHOP AND EVERYTHING IS DOWN SOUTH, VERY LITTLE TO THE NORTH. THEY'RE GOING TO TAKE ALL THAT TRAFFIC, ACCORDING TO WHAT THE STATE SENT OUT, AND THEY'RE GOING TO ROUTE THAT OVER THAT BRIDGE THERE ON US 1 AND TURN IT RIGHT ON ONE LANE ON TO MALAGA. ACCORDING TO WHAT THE STATE SENT OUT, THEY'RE GOING TO CLOSE OFF THE CROSSOVER AT CARRERA AND PUT IN A TEMPORARY LIGHT THERE AT MALAGA IN US 1, WHICH IS GOING TO STOP THE TRAFFIC FROM [NOISE] THE US 1 IN ORDER TO LET ONE LANE OF TRAFFIC GO SOUTH ONTO US 1. THEN, EVERYTHING ELSE IS GOING TO COME DOWN TO MALAGA. WE HAVE A FIRE STATION ON MALAGA THAT IS GOING TO BE GRIDLOCKED. WE HAVE THE POLICE STATION RIGHT THERE AT THE CORNER OF KING AND MALAGA, AND IT'S GOING TO BE IN GRIDLOCK. THE PEOPLE LIVING OVER IN WEST AUGUSTINE ARE GOING TO HAVE VERY DIFFICULT TIME GETTING ANY SERVICE TO ANYTHING. THEN, IT'S GOING TO BE SOLID TRAFFIC RIGHT DOWN AT LEAST TO RIBERIA. RIBERIA HAS THE CITY MAINTENANCE, WHATEVER THE CORRECT TERM IS, DOWN AT THE END AND THAT'S WHERE ALL YOUR STREET SWEEPERS ARE, YOUR GARBAGE TRUCKS, EVERYTHING, NOT TO MENTION [NOISE] THE FACT THAT THEY SEND THE SEMI DOWN THERE TO PICK UP THE SLUDGE; [00:10:02] I DON'T KNOW HOW OFTEN, BUT I KNOW THEY DO IT. YOU'VE GOT AN OLD FOLKS HOME, A NURSING HOME BACK AT THE OLD HOSPITAL. I DON'T KNOW HOW THE EMERGENCY VEHICLES ARE GOING GET TO THAT. YOU'VE GOT THE FLORIDA NATIONAL GUARD HEADQUARTERS, YOU'VE GOT THE BORDER PATROLS, YOU GOT BOATS DOWN THERE. THEY JUST FINISHED A NEW TRANSMISSION FACILITY FOR FLORIDA POWER AND LIGHT, THAT'S HUGE. THEY'RE GOING TO DO THIS WORK SUPPOSEDLY A YEAR FROM JUNE, RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING OF HURRICANE SEASON. WE'VE HAD FOUR STORM SURGE FLOODS IN [NOISE] SIX YEARS. [NOISE] >> THANK YOU, MR. HALL. >> ALSO, THE POST OFFICE IS DOWNTOWN. >> THANK YOU, MR. HALL. WE HAVE OUR LAST SPEAKER, [INAUDIBLE]. >> MAYOR, WHILE OUR NEXT SPEAKER COMES UP, I JUST WANTED TO LET THE AUDIENCE IN THE ROOM KNOW THAT WE'RE HAVING SOME TECHNICAL ISSUES WITH OUR AUDIO SYSTEM AND SO PLEASE BEAR WITH US. IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WERE NOT ABLE TO CLEAR OUT BEFORE THIS MEETING. >> [INAUDIBLE]. >> BJ KLINE. >> AWESOME. IT'S REAL LOUD. BJ KLINE, WEST CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE BUT I'M NOT YELLING AT YOU. TO THE NEWLY ELECTED COMMISSIONERS ON THIS COMMISSION. WELCOME. LET ME EXTEND THE SAME INVITATION TO VISIT 12 NEWCOMB STREET WHICH OTHER COMMISSIONERS AND MR. REAGAN HAVE NOT VISITED. FOR YEARS IN THE WEST AUGUSTINE'S CITY LIMITS, THERE HAS BEEN ONGOING ILLEGAL FIREWORKS, WHICH THE POLICE HAVE BEEN UNABLE TO ENFORCE. THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE'S ORDINANCE CLEARLY STATES FIREWORKS ARE NOT ALLOWED IN THE CITY LIMITS. THIS INCLUDES ALL HOLIDAYS SUCH AS JULY 4TH AND JANUARY 1ST WHICH IS COMING UP. I NEED TO SAY THIS. [NOISE] THIS IS HOW I FEEL AND I THINK OTHER PEOPLE ARE TOO. SELFISH INDIVIDUALS, NO RESPECT, ARE DESTROYING THE LIVABILITY AT THE CITY LIMITS OF ST. AUGUSTINE AND CREATING LIGHTING. PLEASE PROTECT THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR ALL RESIDENTS LIVING IN THE CITY LIMITS OF ST. AUGUSTINE. THANK YOU. >> WE ARE LOUD ENOUGH. [LAUGHTER] >> OTHER COMMENTS ARE CLOSED. WE MOVE ON TO ITEM 4B, THIS [INAUDIBLE] >> I THINK WE SKIPPED OVER [OVERLAPPING] >> CONSENT. >> WE SKIP OVER ANYTHING OR WE DID NOT. >> OH, WE HAVE THE CONSENT AGENDA. DID YOU WANT TO DO MY ITEM FIRST? WE CAN CERTAINLY [OVERLAPPING] DO THAT. I WILL DO THAT THEN. IN THE BACK ROOM ARE COPIES OF A PROPOSED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT. [Additional Item] IT CONSISTS OF A THREE-PART PACKAGE, SO FOLKS ARE INTERESTED IN LOOKING AT IT. THERE IS A LARGE PACKAGE TITLED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT, AND THERE IS A SEPARATE SMALLER PACKAGE WITH WHAT IS THE EXHIBIT B TO THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT, AND THEN THERE IS A ONE-PAGE CORRECTION ON SOME LANGUAGE IN THE STIPULATION. ESSENTIALLY, THAT THREE-PART DOCUMENT CONSISTS OF A PROPOSED SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT BETWEEN ESSAY MARINA HOLDINGS, LLC AND THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE TO RESOLVE DUAL LITIGATION. ONE LAWSUIT IS THE OUTCOME OF A PETITION FOR WRIT OF CERTIORARI, WHICH IS IN STATE COURT, AND THE OTHER LAWSUIT IS A FEDERAL MATTER IN THE MIDDLE DISTRICT IN JACKSONVILLE IN THE FEDERAL COURT. THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT CONSISTS OF A NUMBER OF RECITALS WHICH BASICALLY JUST TELLS THE STORY OF THE SEBASTIAN INLAND HARBOR PUD THAT WENT THROUGH SUCCESSIVE OWNERSHIP, SUCCESSIVE PUDS, AND ULTIMATELY ABOUT A YEAR, YEAR-AND-A-HALF AGO, THE TWO REMAINING OWNERS OF THE PUD FILED FOR A REZONING TO A CONVENTIONAL AKA A STRAIGHT ZONING OUT OF PUD TO THE RGO ZONING. THE CITY COMMISSION AT THE TIME APPROVED THE WINERY PORTION OWNED BY STEPHEN AND ALLOWED THAT PORTION, WHICH IS THE NORTHERN PORTION FRONTING KING STREET, TO BE REZONED AND DENIED THE BACK PORTION UNDER SEPARATE OWNERSHIP, WHICH I'LL CALL THE ADP, THE SOUTHERN PART OF THE PUD. THAT RESULTED IN THE LAWSUIT FROM THAT OWNERSHIP. ON DECEMBER 2, THE CITY COMMISSION WAS SURPRISED THAT A RULING BY THE CIRCUIT COURT JUDGE ON THE STATE MATTER, [00:15:05] THE JUDGE RULED [NOISE] PARDON ME, THAT THE CITY COMMISSION ERRED ON ITS DETERMINATION TO DENY THE REZONING AND ORDERED US TO PROCEED IN CONSORT WITH HIS ORDER, WHICH WOULD MEAN HOLDING THE SECOND READING ON THE ORDINANCE TO REZONE THAT PARCEL. IN THE INTERIM, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME NEGOTIATIONS BETWEEN THE PARTIES PRELIMINARY NEGOTIATIONS THAT RESULTED IN THIS SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT BEFORE YOU THAT MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC CAN TAKE A LOOK AT IN THE BACK OF THE ROOM. IT WOULD RESOLVE THE MATTERS BETWEEN THE PARTIES. CONSISTS OF HIGHLIGHTS AGREEMENT BY THE CITY COMMISSION NOT TO INSTRUCT ME TO FURTHER APPEAL THE CERTIORARI, MEANING THE STATE LAWSUIT, TO STOP ANY LITIGATION GOING FORWARD ON THAT, THERE IS A POTENTIAL OPPORTUNITY TO APPEAL OUR LOCAL JUDGES RULING TO THE FIFTH DISTRICT COURT OF APPEAL. THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT ON THE FIRST NOTABLE TERM IS THAT THE CITY COMMISSION INSTRUCTS ME TO STAND DOWN ON THAT. SECONDLY, THAT THE CITY COMMISSION GO FORWARD AND SCHEDULE THE REZONING FOR THE PROPERTY. WE WERE TENTATIVELY BELIEVING THAT WE CAN MAKE THAT HAPPEN FOR OUR 1ST JANUARY CITY COMMISSION MEETING, AND SO THAT WOULD BE THE SECOND PART OF THE AGREEMENT. THEN THE THIRD PART IS AFTER THE PERIOD OF TIME AVAILABLE FOR THIRD PARTIES TO CHALLENGE THE OUTCOME OF THAT REZONING HEARING. HYPOTHETICALLY, THE JANUARY REZONING HEARING, AFTER THAT APPEAL PERIOD TERMINATES, IF THERE ARE NO CHALLENGES TO THE REZONING THAT THE PRIVATE PARTY SAN MARINO, WOULD DISMISS THE FEDERAL LAWSUIT IN EXCHANGE FOR THE CITY PAYING THE ATTORNEY'S FEES OF $200,000 ON THAT MATTER. WE'VE RECEIVED APPROVAL FROM OUR INSURANCE CARRIER FOR THAT $200,000 AMOUNT. IF THERE IS A THIRD-PARTY CHALLENGE TO THE HYPOTHETICAL REZONING IN JANUARY, THAT IN THAT CASE, SAN MARINO RESERVES AN ADDITIONAL FIVE DAYS TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THEY WANT TO GO FORWARD WITH THE TERMS OF OUR SETTLEMENT, MEANING THEY DISMISS THE FEDERAL CASE, THEY OBTAIN THE $200,000 PAYMENT AND THE DISPUTE AS TO BETWEEN ARCHERY PARTIES IS OVER, OR THEY CHOOSE TO FOREGO THE $200,000 PAYMENT AND PROCEED ON AND CONTINUE THEIR FEDERAL LAWSUIT. THAT'S ESSENTIALLY THE GUTS OF THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT, AND I'M AVAILABLE FOR ANY QUESTIONS EITHER FROM THE COMMISSION OR I WOULD SUGGEST YOU OPEN UP PUBLIC COMMENT. I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE FOLKS IN THE AUDIENCE WHO WOULD LIKE TO COMMENT ON IT, AND I CAN RESPOND AS DIRECTED BY THE COMMISSION THEREAFTER. >> ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF BEFORE WE OPEN PUBLIC COMMENT? BUT IF ANYBODY HAS ANY DESIRE TO SPEAK ON THE MATTER, SPECIFICALLY TO THIS MATTER, PLEASE COME FORWARD NOW. SEEING NO ONE, PUBLIC COMMENT IS CLOSE. COMMISSIONERS, ANY DISCUSSION? >> I [INAUDIBLE] TO WHAT HAS BEEN PRESENTED BY OUR ATTORNEY. >> SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT? >> YES. >> THEN THAT WOULD INCLUDE SCHEDULING THE PRESENTING FOR JANUARY 19? >> YES. THAT IS WHAT WE ARE ESTIMATING, YES. >> [INAUDIBLE] ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION BEFORE WE GO? MADAM CLERK, CALL ROLL CALL, PLEASE. >> ROXANNE HORVATH. >> YES. >> JIM SPRINGFIELD, CYNTHIA GARRIS. >> YES >> BARBARA BLONDER? >> YES. >> NANCY SIKES-KLINE. >> YES. >> THANK YOU. >> WE MOVE ON TO ITEM 5 WHICH IS CONSENT AGENDA. [5. CONSENT AGENDA] DOES ANYONE HAVE A LOT OF VACATION TO CONSENT AGENDA? >> I'D LIKE TO PULL PART C AGAIN. [00:20:01] >> I'LL SECOND THAT. [INAUDIBLE] AGENDA, SIGNIFY BY SAYING, AYE. >> AYE. >> AYE. >> AYE. >> THEN MR. SPRINGFIELD, CITY MANAGER, MEANING THEY WILL HAVE THE RIGHT CONSENT AGENDA. >> MAYOR, COMMISSIONERS, ON TONIGHT'S CONSENT AGENDA, WE HAVE A REMINDER OF UPCOMING MEETINGS. JANUARY 9TH, 2023, 5:00 PM, REGULAR CITY COMMISSION MEETING. JANUARY 23RD, 2023, 5:00 PM, REGULAR CITY COMMISSION MEETING. FEBRUARY 13TH, 2023, 5:00 PM, REGULAR CITY COMMISSION MEETING. WE HAVE APPROVAL OF MINUTES FROM PRIOR COMMISSION MEETINGS; THE REGULAR CITY COMMISSION MEETING OCTOBER 10TH, 2022, REGULAR CITY COMMISSION MEETING OCTOBER 24TH, 2022, REGULAR CITY COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 14TH, 2022. WE HAVE A RELEASE OF LIEN FOR UNIT CONNECTION IF WE MORTGAGE AT 575B HELEN STREET, HD TOMMY MANUSI. WE HAVE A NOTICE OF PROCLAMATION 2023-03. COMMITS TO SUPPORT ACTIVE PEOPLE, HEALTHY NATION STRATEGIES. WE HAVE A PROPORTIONATE SHARE MITIGATION AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE ST. JOHNS COUNTY SCHOOL DISTRICT, THE CITY AND SHIPYARDS MULTIFAMILY LLC FOR THE COLLECTION OF SCHOOL DISTRICT IMPACT FEES FOR NEW RESIDENTIAL CONSTRUCTION. WE HAVE APPROVAL OF THE 2023 CITY COMMISSION MEETING AND HOLIDAY SCHEDULE. WE HAVE THE INVOICE RESPONSE ASSOCIATES SLASH MADEIRA SUBDIVISION FOR BAKER AND HUSTLER, LLP, IN THE AMOUNT OF $5,510.50, AND WE HAVE AN INVOICE FOR $4,338.90 FROM CAVENDISH PARTNERS FOR SERVICES RENDERED IN THE PHILLIP SMITH VERSUS CITY MATTER. >> GOT A MOTION TO APPROVE AND TRY TO TURN THAT. OH, WAIT, YOU DID THAT, RIGHT? >> YEAH. >> THE APPROVED SCHEDULE. >> DID YOU APPROVE IT? >> NO. WE DID NOT. >> NO. >> [LAUGHTER] [INAUDIBLE] ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE. >> AYE. >>OKAY. THAT AGENDA PASSED. WE HAVE A QUESTION CONCERNING ITEM 10A. [CA.10. Approval of interpretive panels for installation at Fish Island Preserve. (R. Franklin, Director Public Works)] THE [INAUDIBLE] THAT IS GUARDING THE FISH ISLAND OBSERVED INTERPRETIVE PANELS [NOISE]. >>I KNOW, WHEN I FIRST SAW THIS, I WANTED TO TALK ABOUT IT. I'M ON POOL NOW, I DON'T HAVE ANY DESIRE TO STOP THE PROGRESS, BUT MY BACKGROUND IN AND OUT OF THIS CENTER FOR 11 YEARS AND I'M EXCITED ABOUT THIS BECAUSE I'VE BEEN HIKING UP THERE MYSELF AND IT JUST NEEDS SOME DIRECTION AND SOME EDUCATION ASIDE FROM THAT. BUT I'VE ALWAYS BEEN FOCUSED ON KIDS, THESE CENTERS MAY BE FULL OF THEM OR NOT. REALLY APART FROM THE FAMILIES WITH KIDS. I'D LIKE FOR THE STAFF TO CONSIDER EITHER AN ALTERNATIVE TRAIL THAT WOULD BE GEARED TOWARD CHILDREN, THAT GIVES FIELD TRIPS FOR FAMILIES. ALSO [NOISE], ADDITIONAL PANELS. THEN AS OUR SPEAKER MENTIONED, THERE COULD BE SOME MORE DISCUSSION ABOUT INCLUDING MORE [INAUDIBLE] I CAN'T SPEAK TO THAT, BUT I CAN SPEAK HAVING INTERPRETIVE PANELS WILL BE A LARGE REQUIREMENT WOULD BE POSSIBLE THANKS TO THE [INAUDIBLE]. I JUST WANTED TO [INAUDIBLE] >> WELL, I'M EXCITED ABOUT WHAT WE HAVE SO FAR. I MIGHT CONSIDER PAGE 1 IN MULTIPLE CASES. SO THE PANEL WILL HANDLE THAT IN THE SECOND CASE. BUT YEAH, IT'S SO EXCITING TO SEE WE'RE ACTUALLY GOING TO HAVE SOME PRACTICE OUT THERE. I LIKE THE IDEA OF OUR SECOND DAY OF [INAUDIBLE] >> I THINK THAT'S GOOD. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? >> I FIRST WANTED TO START BY THANKING STAFF FOR THEIR TIRELESS WORK ON ALL THEY'VE DONE IN CONCERT WITH THE FISH ISLAND ASSOCIATION, IN WORKING WITH EXPERTS, CONSULTANTS, AND SO FORTH, TO GET US TO THIS PLACE. PERSONALLY, AS SOME OF YOU KNOW, I'VE WORKED WITH J. B MILAN IN MY REGULAR CAREER AND HE'S PROBABLY THE BEST IN THE BUSINESS. WE'RE VERY, VERY LUCKY TO HAVE HIM. TO SHOW THESE INTERPRETIVE PANELS IN CONCERT WITH THE REVIEW BY BOTH CITY AND OUTSIDE CULTURAL AND NATURAL RESOURCE PROFESSIONALS WERE DEVELOPED. I DO WANT TO ADDRESS THE COMMENTS THAT WERE PROVIDED TO ME [INAUDIBLE]. THEY WERE EMAILED TO OTHER COMMISSIONERS. [00:25:01] BUT I RECEIVED THREE EMAILS WITH VERY EXTENSIVE CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM ABOUT WHAT'S CONTAINED ON THE PANELS AND I WANT TO ADDRESS THIS. BUT I THINK WHAT WE'VE GOTTEN IS REALLY, REALLY GOOD, WHAT WE SEE HERE. WHAT WE DON'T SEE IS THE WELCOME SIGN, WHICH IS IN PROCESS AND MAYBE WE CAN HAVE A LOOK AT THAT AND THEIR FURTHER HISTORICAL INFORMATION THAT'S ON THAT IN JUST A MINUTE. BUT THANK YOU FOR BEING ON TIME. I'M ALMOST DONE HERE. BUT I WORRY ABOUT IDENTIFYING ARCHAEOLOGICAL SITES ON THE MAP BECAUSE THERE ARE LOTS AND LOTS OF TREASURE HUNTERS OUT THERE AND I THINK WE RISK LOSING, ACTUALLY HAVING THAT STEP REMOVED, STOLEN, OR DAMAGED. SO I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF PUTTING THESE THINGS ON A SPECIFIC NOW, JUST KNOWING THAT THEY ARE THERE AND [INAUDIBLE] IT IS THE BEST WE CAN DO TO CONTINUE TO STUDY THEN THEOLOGISTS AND THE EXPERTISE THAT WE HAVE IN OUR COMMUNITY WHICH WE'RE VERY LUCKY TO HAVE. I KNOW BUT BECAUSE MY WORD IN NATURE PRESERVES AND FLORIDA STATE PARKS, ON NATIONALISTS OR ANY SEARCH RESERVES AND SO FORTH, THAT INTERPRETATION IS REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT. BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT PEOPLE ARE EAGER TO GET ON THE TRAILS. THEY ARE EAGER TO SEE WILDLIFE, THEY'RE EAGER TO SEE THE CONTEXT OF THE ARCHAEOLOGY, THE HISTORY. THEY'RE NOT LIKELY TO SPEND 20 MINUTES READING INTERPRETIVE PANELS. I THINK THAT THIS IS COMMON KNOWLEDGE IF YOU PUT TOO MUCH INFORMATION ON A PANEL LIST, IT WILL BE LOST TO THE REGULAR VISITOR. I THINK, AND I THINK STAFF IS AHEAD OF ME ON THIS, THE QR CODES, ON THESE SIGNS THAT PROVIDE ADDITIONAL. TAKE THIS, IF YOU SCAN A QR CODE, YOU TAKE YOUR PIPE, YOU GO HOME, YOU LEARN MORE ABOUT IT. YOU WANT TO COME BACK BECAUSE HE LEARNED MORE ABOUT IT. YOU SAW HALF A DOZEN OF THE BIRDS AND YOU WANT TO COME BACK AND SEE THE OTHER HALF OF DOZEN BIRDS SO WHATEVER YOU LIKE. WITH THAT WE'RE HAVING A BADGE IF YOU WOULD TALK ABOUT THAT ADDITIONAL SIGNAGE THAT'S COMING IN THE PIPELINE. I APPRECIATE IT. THANK YOU. >> RUEBEN, YOU'RE RECOGNIZED [OVERLAPPING]. >> GOOD EVENING, MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS. REUBEN FRANKLIN, PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR. MR. MILLER IS HERE AS WELL IN CASE THERE'S ANY DETAILED QUESTIONS. BUT THERE WERE TWO THINGS THAT WEREN'T IN THE PACKET THAT WE WERE WORKING ON AS WELL. ONE WAS A WELCOME ENTRANCE SIGN THAT'S GOING TO GO AT THE ENTRANCE OF THE PARK IN THE PARKING AREA. THAT SIGN IS GOING TO BE LIKE 3 FT. WE'RE PLANNING TO HAVE IT BE 3 FT BY 5 FT. BUT THEY WERE TWO THINGS WE WANTED TO ACCOMPLISH BEFORE WE PUBLISH THAT SIGN. WE ARE ALL WORKING ON A NEW TRAIL. I HEARD THAT COMMENT AND I THINK WE COULD INTEGRATE THAT INTO THE NEW TRAIL, AND THEN THEY'RE ALSO OCCURRED OBSERVING PLATFORM. WE WANTED TO GET THOSE TWO THINGS DONE SO WE CAN INCLUDE THEM INTO BIG MAP. IN THE MEANTIME, WE HAVE A TEMPORARY SIGN THAT JUST HAS A MAP. THESE ARE THE PANELS THAT WE'RE IN HERE FOR APPROVAL. BUT THIS IS THE TEMPORARY SIGNAGE THAT'S GOING TO BE AT THE FRONT OF THE PARK UNTIL WE CAN GET THAT BIGGER WELCOME SIGN DONE. THE OTHER THING THAT'S GOING TO BE AT THE FRONT OF THE PARK TOO IS THE HISTORICAL MARKER. THIS WAS NOT INCLUDED IN THE PANELS BECAUSE WE WERE JUST GOING THROUGH THE APPROVAL OF THE PANELS. BUT THIS GIVES A LITTLE MORE CONTEXT OF JESSE FISH, THE ARCHAEOLOGICAL [NOISE] RUINS TOO, IT ADDRESSES THE CABINET AND THINGS IN THIS. THIS WAS PRIMARILY A DRAFT THAT WAS GIVEN FROM MRS. CHANCE, WHICH IS WHAT WAS THE BASIS FOR THIS HISTORICAL MARKER AND OF COURSE, IT WENT VETTED THROUGH THE DEPARTMENT OF STATE AS WELL. THIS WILL BE OUT THERE ALONG WITH THE PANELS. THE FINAL THING IS THAT WE DIDN'T TEND TO HAVE QR CODES ON THE PANELS TO GO THAT WOULD LINK YOU TO THE WEBSITE PAGE THAT WILL HAVE MORE INFORMATION. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY MORE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PROBLEM. WE DID TAKE FEEDBACK FROM MULTIPLE SOURCES. FRIENDS AT FISH ISLAND WAS ONE. THEN MR. MILLER DID DISTILL ALL OF THAT AND DROP THE PANELS THAT ARE HERE FOR YOUR APPROVAL. >> I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THAT. WHAT I SEE HERE DOES NOT INCLUDE A QR CODE BUT YOU'RE SAYING THAT WHAT I SEE HERE WILL INCLUDE QR CODES. >> THE QR ARE JUST STICKERS. WE'LL GET THE QR CODE AND WE'LL PUT IT ON THE PANEL AND THEN YOU JUST SNAP A PICTURE OF IT AND IT WILL DIRECT YOU DIRECTLY TO THE SITE. I DID RESPOND TO THE EMAIL THIS AFTERNOON. THESE ARE EIGHT PANELS THAT ARE FOR APPROVAL TONIGHT BUT [00:30:02] THERE IS NO LIMIT OR CAP ON THE NUMBER OF PANELS. WE COULD ALWAYS ADD PANELS IN THE FUTURE. WE COULD DO ONE ABOUT THE RUINS, BUT AS WAS DISCUSSED, WE HAD SOME CONCERNS ABOUT HIGHLIGHTING THE RUINS AND HAVING PEOPLE GO PICKING THROUGH THE SITE. BUT THAT'S NOT TO SAY THAT WE CAN'T DO A RUINED SITE THAT'S MORE GENERALIZED, INSTEAD OF BEING SPECIFIC. >> YEAH [INAUDIBLE] >> MAYOR, COMMISSIONERS, [NOISE] ONE THING THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL IS TO ALSO INCLUDE THE FRONT ENTRANCE SIGN, THE INTERPRETIVE SIGN JUST IN YOUR MOTION, THAT WOULD BE GREAT. IF WE COULD JUST KNOCK THAT OUT TOO. >> I HAVE ONE COMMENT TO SAY [INAUDIBLE]. >> THANK YOU. I'D LIKE TO MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE EIGHT INTERPRETIVE PANELS PLUS THE HISTORICAL MARKER AT THE ENTRYWAY THAT WE JUST SAW. I KNOW THAT'S STILL WORK IN PROGRESS BUT THAT'S MY MOTION. >> ANY SECOND? >> I SECOND THAT. >> WE'RE BACK INTO SESSION AND I'D JUST LIKE TO ADD TO WHAT YOU HAD SAID MR. [INAUDIBLE] ABOUT PROTECTING THE ARCHAEOLOGICAL SITE LOCATIONS. BUT I HEAR STUFF [INAUDIBLE] BY GENERAL REFERENCE TO IT OR ACTUALLY MARKING IT SO THAT [INAUDIBLE] OR FOR EXAMPLE, [INAUDIBLE] HUNTING, THAT MAKES THE PEOPLE. [6.A. Appeal of action by Planning and Zoning Board regarding 13 Dolphin Drive offering options to be considered. (D. Birchim, Assistant City Manager)] [00:38:48] >> [NOISE] I'D LIKE TO TURN IN A CARD. [INAUDIBLE] CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE. UPHOLD THE DECISION OF THE PZB ON NOVEMBER 1, 2022. SELL THE PROPERTY. USE THE PROCEEDS OF THE SALE TO IMPROVE THE CURRENT ARCHAEOLOGY CENTER AT 30 PELLICER LANE. MANY PEOPLE, IN THIS ROOM PROBABLY, AND IN OUR COMMUNITY, DOES NOT KNOW THAT ONE WAS ESTABLISHED OVER THERE YEARS AGO, WHICH IS CLOSE TO THE EVELYN HAMBLEN CENTER. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANYBODY ELSE THAT WANTED TO SPEAK? I DON'T SEE ANYONE, SO WE'LL CLOSE THE COMMENT AND GET BACK TO THE BOARD FOR ANY DISCUSSION. [NOISE]. >> WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO TAKE A MOTION? >> I AM WILLING TO TAKE A MOTION. [LAUGHTER] I WOULD MOVE THAT WE UPHOLD THE DECISION OF THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD REGARDING REZONING THIS PROPERTY. >> ANYBODY ELSE? SECOND? DO I HAVE A SECOND? I WOULD LIKE TO SECOND THAT. NOW FIRST AND A SECOND. [00:40:01] LET'S SEE WHAT WE NEED TO DO. ROLL CALL, OKAY. >> YES, MA'AM. >> WE'LL DO A ROLL CALL. >> BARBARA BLONDER. >> YES. >> ROXANNE HORVATH. >> YES. >> CYNTHIA GARRIS. >> I'M CONFUSED ABOUT THAT. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE GOING FORWARD WITH THE SELLING, IF I'M BEING HONEST. YES. >> JIM SPRINGFIELD. >> YES. >> THANK YOU, VICE MAYOR. I FORGOT TO MENTION ONE VERY IMPORTANT THING. I'D LIKE TO THANK THE FAMILY OF THE MIDDLETONS AND SYKES'S FOR THEIR GENEROUS DONATION TO THE CITY. >> YES. WE ALL THANK THEM AS WELL. [NOISE] WE'RE SITUATED HERE. WE ARE ON ITEM 6B, [6.B. Appeal of action by Planning and Zoning Board denying a variance request related to the expansion of an existing parking facility on or near 63 Hypolita Street. (A. Skinner, Director Planning and Building)] AN APPEAL BY PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD DENYING A VARIANCE REQUEST RELATED TO THE EXPANSION OF AN EXISTING PARKING FACILITY ON OR NEAR 63 HYPOLITA. MS. SKINNER, YOU'RE UP. >> GOOD EVENING. MY NAME IS AMY SKINNER. I'M THE DIRECTOR OF THE PLANNING AND BUILDING DEPARTMENT. [NOISE] EXCUSE ME. AS STATED, THIS IS AN APPEAL OF A PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD ACTION DENYING THE VARIANCE REQUESTS RELATED TO 63 HYPOLITA STREET. AN APPLICATION WAS SUBMITTED BY LEN WEEKS TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD FOR A VARIANCE TO USE THE PROPERTY AS A PARKING LOT. THIS WOULD ADD EITHER THREE OR FIVE PARKING SPACES TO THE EXISTING LOT. THE PROPERTY AT THE EAST AND WEST ARE BOTH PARKING LOTS, AS STATED IN HIS APPLICATION, CONTINGENT UPON HOWARD'S APPROVAL, WE WOULD LIKE TO DEMOLISH THE EXISTING BUILDING AND CREATE ONE CONTINUOUS PARKING LOT. THIS APPLICATION WAS SIGNED ON SEPTEMBER 8TH. THE APPLICATION WAS HEARD BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD AT THEIR REGULARLY SCHEDULED OCTOBER 4TH MEETING. THE PZB DENIED THE ITEM WITH A 5-2 VOTE. THE MOTION STATED THAT THE APPLICATION DID NOT MEET THE CRITERIA FOR A VARIANCE, SPECIFICALLY ITEMS B AND D, OF THE FOUR VARIANCE CRITERIA AS REFERENCED IN THE CODE SECTION 28, 29. ITEM B STATES THAT THE PROPERTY MUST HAVE A DISADVANTAGE THAT IMPACTS THE OWNER'S ABILITY TO MAKE REASONABLE USE OF THE AFFECTED POVERTY. THE DISADVANTAGE WAS NOT A SINGULAR DISADVANTAGE AS FOUND BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD. ITEM D OF THE CRITERIA FOR GRANTING A VARIANCE STATES THAT THE GRANTING OF THE VARIANCE MUST NOT BE IN CONTRARY TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST. GRANTING THE VARIANCES ARE NOT IN THE PUBLIC INTERESTS AS DETERMINED BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD. ALL PROCEDURAL ASPECTS OF THE PZB HEARING WERE CORRECTLY FOLLOWED, AND THE WRITTEN ORDERS ACCOMPANYING THESE HEARINGS WERE PROPERLY NOTATED. THE OCTOBER PZB HEARING INCLUDED PUBLIC TESTIMONY FROM THE APPLICANT AND MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC. THE PZB MATERIAL THAT WAS SUBMITTED INTO THE RECORD AS PART OF THE APPLICATION IS ATTACHED. ADDITIONALLY, THE CITY CLERK'S OFFICE HAS PROVIDED THE COMMISSION WITH PICTURES THAT WERE SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT AT THE PZB MEETING, PASSED TO THE BOARD MEMBERS AT THE MEETING, AND SUBMITTED TO THE CLERK AT THE MEETING. THE APPEAL APPLICATION DESCRIBES THE GROUNDS FOR THIS APPEAL, STATING THAT THE PZB'S DENIAL OF THE APPLICATION WOULD LEAVE A VOID IN THE STREET AND NOT ALLOW THE PROPERTY TO BE IMPROVED. THE APPELLANT REQUESTS THAT THE CITY COMMISSION EVALUATE THE APPEAL AND OVERTURN THE PZB DENIAL SO THAT THEY CAN EXPAND AND RECONFIGURE THE PARKING LOT INTO THE AREA PREVIOUSLY OCCUPIED BY THE BUILDING. THANK YOU. I'M AVAILABLE IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. >> ANY QUESTIONS? [NOISE] >> AGAIN, WE'LL NEED EX PARTE DISCLOSURE AS THIS IS A QUASI-JUDICIAL MATTER AND A REMINDER THAT THIS IS BASED ON THE RECORD BELOW, NO NEW EVIDENCE, AND NO NEW TESTIMONY, WHICH IS WHY WE ARE NOT PLACING FOLKS UNDER OATH UNLESS THE APPLICANT REQUESTS A MODIFICATION OF THEIR APPLICATION. >> OKAY. LET'S START. COMMISSIONER GARRIS, DID YOU HAVE ANY EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS? >> NO, I HAVEN'T HEARD FROM ANYBODY. I TALKED A LITTLE BIT TO CITY STAFF, AND I DID GO TO THE AREA BECAUSE I HAD GOTTEN THE PACKET. WHAT I'VE NOTICED WITH THE AREA, [00:45:03] THAT PLANT LOOKS HORRIBLY. IT'S NOT GOOD. >> WELL, WE'LL GET TO THAT. WE'LL HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO TAKE YOUR COMMENTS, BUT RIGHT NOW, WE'RE IN EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS. [OVERLAPPING] DID YOU RECEIVE ANY EMAILS OR HAD ANY DISCUSSIONS? >> NO. >> THAT'S ALL RIGHT NOW. >> I SPOKE WITH MR. WEEKS MAYBE TWO MONTHS AGO BECAUSE I HEARD THAT THEY'RE PLANNING SOMETHING IMPORTANT. >> I SPOKE TO MR. WEEKS PRIOR TO THANKSGIVING. [NOISE] >> [INAUDIBLE] [LAUGHTER] I MET WITH MR. WEEKS AT HIS REQUEST PRIOR TO THANKSGIVING. I HAVE ALSO SPOKEN TO PAUL WEAVER ON THE CAR, AND I'VE VISITED THE SITE BEFORE AND AFTER THE DEMOLITION OF THE BUILDING WITHIN THE SAME MONTH. [NOISE] >> I HAVE VISITED THE SITE TWICE, AND I DIDN'T SPEAK TO MR. WEEKS AT ALL. >> VERY GOOD. THANK YOU. LET'S MOVE TO PUBLIC COMMENTS. I HAVE A NUMBER OF SPEAKER CARDS IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER. MR. THOMAS MAROTTA. I'M SORRY IF THAT IS THE WRONG PRONUNCIATION. [OVERLAPPING] YES. I'LL CALL THE SPEAKER CARDS [INAUDIBLE] DID NOT FILL OUT THE SPEAKER CARD, PLEASE DO SO. [INAUDIBLE]. MR. MAROTTA. >> THOMAS MAROTTA, RIGHT. WELL, THANK YOU FOR HEARING US. WE'VE BEEN WORKING WITH MR. WEEKS ON PARKING. WE CERTAINLY SUPPORT THIS GRANT. >> SIR, DO YOU MIND GIVING US YOUR ADDRESS JUST SO THE RECORD'S CLEAR? >> SURE, ME AND MY WIFE ARE OWNERS OF SCHMAGEL'S BAGELS, 69 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. >> THANK YOU. >> OKAY. WE HAD HEARD THAT THERE WAS A DENIAL OF THE PARKING LOT AND THERE'S PROBABLY A LOT OF GOOD REASONS WHY PARKING SHOULD BE APPROVED. THERE'S A LOT OF EMPLOYEE ISSUES THAT COULD BE SOLVED WITH PARKING, BUT FOR US, WE ARRIVE IN ST. AUGUSTINE EVERY MORNING ABOUT 2:30 IN THE MORNING, AND THEY HAVE A PLACE TO PARK THAT'S NEAR OUR BUSINESS IS A LOT MORE BENEFICIAL FOR PARTICULARLY MY WIFE IN NAVIGATING THE STREETS. THERE'S A LOT OF HOMELESS, THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF ACTIVITY AT THE COMMONPLACE QUITE A BIT. FOR US IT'S A SAFETY ISSUE, AND I WOULD ASK THAT YOU RECONSIDER THE [INAUDIBLE]. >> THANK YOU, MR. MAROTTA. I HAVE NEXT BENJAMIN BRANDOW. STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. >> BENJAMIN BRANDOW. MY ADDRESS IS 4420 CARTER ROAD ST. AUGUSTINE. MY BUSINESS IS LOCATED AT 62 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. RECENTLY RENTED AN OFFICE SPACE THERE ACROSS THE STREET FROM THE PROPERTIES IN QUESTION. I'M HERE TO SPEAK TO THE DISADVANTAGE THAT HAS GIVEN ME AN ADVANTAGE BECAUSE MR. WEEKS HAS A PRESTIGIOUS OFFICE LOCATION THAT I WAS SURPRISED TO BE ABLE TO GET AT THE PRICE POINT THAT HE'S OFFERING IT, IN PART BECAUSE THERE IS NO PARKING, AND HE SEES THAT IT INHIBITS BUSINESSES FROM BEING TRULY SUCCESSFUL. DESPITE I COULD GET A CUBICLE IN A CORPORATE SPACE SOMEWHERE WITH AMPLE PARKING, I CHOSE TO INCLUDE MYSELF IN THAT DISADVANTAGE. THIS IS A HOT-BUTTON TOPIC, I THINK FOR A LOT OF US, THE PARKING BECAUSE IT'S CREATING A DISADVANTAGE FOR THE ENTIRE CITY. THIS IS AN IMPORTANT TOPIC TO THINK ABOUT CLEARLY ON WHAT OUR LONG-TERM GOALS ARE, NOT JUST ANY SHORT-TERM GAIN. I KNOW MR. WEEKS HAS PLANS FOR PUTTING BUILDINGS THERE, AND THIS IS JUST A TEMPORARY PATCH TO DO THE BEST THAT WE CAN TO HAVE A BEAUTIFUL SPACE WHILE THE CITY CONTINUES TO GROW. BUT I JUST WANTED TO PUT ON MY SUPPORT WITH MR. WEEKS AND I HAVEN'T HAD ANY DIRECT CONVERSATIONS ABOUT THIS. IT'S JUST INTEROFFICE GOSSIP THAT GOT ME HERE. I DID WATCH THE PREVIOUS MEETING AND IT WAS GOOD TO SEE THERE WAS LONG-TERM VISION TAKEN IN THAT NO PERMANENT DECISIONS WERE BEING MADE AT THAT TIME TO DO WHAT IS RIGHT. BUT MR. WEEKS, HIS CHARACTER CERTAINLY STANDS FOR ITSELF. I FEEL VERY FORTUNATE AS A YOUNG BUSINESS OWNER HERE IN TOWN. I STARTED AN ECO-TOUR COMPANY IN 2019 TO KEEP MYSELF BUSY AND DEVELOP BUSINESS. IT GOT TO THE POINT WHERE I'M NOW ABLE TO HELP GROW THE INDUSTRY AS A WHOLE. I'VE BEEN ABLE TO PUT THE AREA ON THE MAP AS A NEW LOCATION. I DISCOVERED BIOLUMINESCENCE IN GUANA LAKE. I HAD TO GET AN OFFICE, A PLACE WHERE I CAN BE FOCUSED AND DO THE DEVELOPMENT AND TRAINING AND HAVE THE MEETINGS THAT I NEED. THE CITY DOESN'T MAKE ANY RECOURSE FOR ME TO BE ABLE TO PAY FOR PARKING. [00:50:03] I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT PERHAPS IF I HAVE TO CONTINUE TO USE A PARKING LOT THAT WE CAN HAVE A TICKET VALIDATIONING SYSTEM, SO WHEN I HAVE PEOPLE OF DISTINCTION THAT COME BY MY OFFICE, I CAN SAY, HEY, PARKED IN THE PARKING GARAGE. THERE'S NOWHERE CLOSER CONVENIENT TO PARK BY, BUT DON'T WORRY ABOUT PAYING, I CAN TAKE CARE OF THAT FOR YOU. THERE'S A LOT OF SOLUTIONS THAT NEED TO BE LOOKED AT AND I RECOMMEND THAT YOU LISTEN TO MR. WEEKS BECAUSE HE'S HAD THE BEST INTERESTS OF OUR CITY AT HEART FOR A LONG TIME. >> THANK YOU, MR.? >> BRANDOW. >> BRANDOW. >> YES. >> THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT, OUR NEXT SPEAKER IS MONA WEARING. MS. MONA, WOULD YOU PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. >> MONA WEARING 80 PARK PLACE AND I WORK AT 62 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. I LIKE TO READ BECAUSE I'M A STUTTERER. I LIVE DOWNTOWN AND WORK DOWNTOWN. >> MAY I INTERRUPT ONE SECOND? CAN YOU PULL THE MICROPHONE SLIGHTLY? >> THERE YOU GO. I LIVE DOWNTOWN AND WORK DOWNTOWN, SO I KNOW THE CHALLENGES WITH PARKING. MY FRIENDS THAT LIVE OUTSIDE OF THE CITY LIMITS AVOID COMING DOWNTOWN AND SUPPORTING LOCAL BUSINESSES DUE TO PARKING ISSUES. NOT ONE OF MY FRIENDS WOULD CONSIDER BEING SHUTTLED IN. I HAVE WORKED FOR MR. WEEKS FOR OVER SEVEN YEARS, LOCATED AT 62 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. WITHOUT A DESIGNATED PARKING SPACE, I WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO PERFORM MY DAILY DUTIES AS MR. WEEKS' ADMINISTRATOR, BOOKKEEPER, AND PERSONAL ASSISTANT. PART OF MY JOB IS TO MAKE SURE OUR TENANTS HAVE THEIR PARKING SPACES AVAILABLE TO THEM, 24/7. I SPEND A LOT OF MY TIME REDIRECTING THE GENERAL PUBLIC TO OTHER PARKING FACILITIES. [NOISE] SORRY, I'M NERVOUS. OUR TENANTS FOLLOW ME AFTER OUT SAYING THAT SOMEONE IS IN THEIR SPACE. IT IS A CONSTANT BATTLE KEEPING THE GENERAL PUBLIC OUT OF THE CURRENT PARKING AT 63 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. THE PLANS PROPOSED WILL ELIMINATE THIS PROBLEM AS WELL AS ADDING BEAUTIFICATION TO THE STREET LIGHTING AND SAFETY. I CAN ALSO ATTEST TO THE FACT THAT OUR THREE TENANTS, ONE JUST SPOKE, IN OUR OFFICE ACROSS THE STREET WOULD NOT RENT THEIR OFFICE SPACE WITHOUT HAVING A PARKING SPACE. THEY LOVE WORKING DOWNTOWN SUPPORTING LOCAL BUSINESSES. A PRIME EXAMPLE TODAY AT 2:00 PM, A PERSON PARKED IN THE SPACE BELONGING TO SCHMAGEL'S BAGELS. SHE SAID SHE LIVED IN THE APARTMENTS ABOVE THE SHOPS ON CORDOBA STREET NEXT TO BAGELS. SHE SAID THAT ONCE BAGELS CLOSES, SHE USES THAT SPACE TO PARK. I SAID SCHMAGEL'S PAYS FOR THAT SPACE 24/7. SHE ASKED IF MR. WEEKS CAN RENT HER A SPACE. I SAID HE DOES NOT HAVE ANY SPACES AVAILABLE. I ASKED HER IF SHE COULD ATTEND TONIGHT'S MEETING, HOWEVER, SHE HAD OTHER PLANS. I HOPE THAT YOU APPROVE THIS VARIANCE BECAUSE MY OPINION IS NOT CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST. DENYING THIS WOULD CREATE HARDSHIP TO MANY OF OUR TENANTS, SMALL BUSINESSES, AND THEIR EMPLOYEES. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME. >> THANK YOU. THE NEXT SPEAKER IS BECKY GEIGER. PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. >> HI. I'M BECKY GEIGER. I'M AT 50 GOING HONEY TRAIL, AND I AM [INAUDIBLE] AT 58 HIPPOLYTU. I WORK DOWNTOWN AND I NEED PARKING. I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU GUYS, BUT NOTHING CAN BE MORE FRUSTRATING THAN DRIVING DOWNTOWN AND NOT BEING ABLE TO GO TO WORK BECAUSE YOU HAVE NOWHERE TO PARK. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS HAVE THAT PROBLEM, BUT WE HAVE IT ALL THE TIME. IMAGINE ON 4TH OF JULY, YOU NEED TO OPEN UP YOUR SHOP AND YOU CAN'T PARK BECAUSE THERE'S NOWHERE TO PARK, AND YOU CAN'T OPEN YOUR BUSINESS BECAUSE THERE'S NOWHERE TO GO. BY PROVIDING THESE PARKING LOTS FOR EMPLOYEES, FOR US OWNERS, ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF, WE NEED THAT PARKING. WITHOUT THAT PARKING, SOME OF OUR SHOPS WOULDN'T EVEN OPEN. I MEAN, JUST THE CHRISTMAS PARADE ALONE, MY EMPLOYEE COULDN'T EVEN GET A PARKING SPACE IN THE PARKING GARAGE, BECAUSE THERE WAS NOWHERE TO PARK THAT DAY. WE DEFINITELY SUPPORT THIS PARKING LOT. WE APPRECIATE IT. THE BUSINESS NEED IT. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. NEXT WE HAVE, IS IT LOUIS OR LOIS STEVENS? >> LOUIS. >> LOUIS. SORRY. APOLOGIES. PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD. >> MY NAME IS LOUIS STEVENS AND I'M IN MR. WEEKS' BUILDING. I LIVE IN ST. AUGUSTINE. AS A TINY BIT OF BACKGROUND, I WENT TO CPS IN ST. JOE AND NOW I'M AN ADULT CHEWING ON GLASS WHILE STARTING MY OWN BUSINESS. I THINK I'M HERE TO VOICE MY SUPPORT FOR MR. WEEKS' INITIATIVE. [00:55:02] I DON T THINK IT'S IMMEDIATELY OBVIOUS TO THE OUTSIDE OBSERVER WHAT MR. WEEKS HAS GOING ON WITHIN HIS BUILDING. THERE'S REALLY A NUCLEUS OF SMALL BUSINESSES BEING DEVELOPED IN HIS BUILDING WITH MINE BEING ONE. MY BUSINESS IS BASICALLY INVESTMENT RESEARCH, WHICH AT TIMES REQUIRES ME TO SEE CLIENTS. I KNOW THAT WE ALSO HAVE EFFECTIVELY AN ENTIRE LAW OFFICE BEING BUILT AND MR. WEEKS BUILDING RIGHT NOW, AND WE ALSO HAVE BINS, VERY INTERESTING AND INCREDIBLE BUSINESS BEING BUILT. I THINK THAT'S JUST WHAT I REALLY WANT TO EMPHASIZE THAT THIS IS NOT JUST MR. WEEKS, THIS IS A CONSTELLATION OF PEOPLE WHO ARE BUILDING THE NEXT-GENERATION OF IMPORTANT BUSINESSES WITHIN ST. AUGUSTINE WHO NEED PARKING. I'M ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE AND I COULDN'T BE LEASING THIS BUILDING WERE IT NOT FOR THE PARKING. I'M HERE TO VOICE MY SUPPORT FOR MR. WEEKS, AND I'M INCREDIBLY GRATEFUL TO BE HERE AND TO BE SPEAKING TO EVERYONE AND VOICING MY SUPPORT. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. UNLESS WE HAVE ANY MORE SPEAKER CARDS. I DO NOT HAVE ANY MORE SENIOR CARDS. MS. DELANY, YOU HAVE TURNED IN A SPEAKER CARD BUT YOU'RE WELCOME TO COME AND SPEAK. >> MARY, AM I THE LAST ONE TO SPEAK? >> YES. >> DJ CLEADY, WEST CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE. AT THE OCTOBER 4TH 2022 PCV MEETING, THE VARIANCE WAS DENIED. ON NOVEMBER 8, 2022, THE CITY BUILDING OFFICIAL WROTE A LETTER TO THE APPLICANT APPROVING DEMOLITION PERMIT FOR 63 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. AS OF NOVEMBER 17, 2022, HARD MEETING AN UNADVERTISED ITEM WAS ADDED AND PASSED TO ALLOW THE EMERGENCY DEMOLITION AT 63 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. UPON THE DENIAL OF A VARIANCE TO APPROVE THE EXPANSION OF A PARKING LOT AT 63 HIPPOLYTUS STREET. AND THEN LISTENING TO SOME COMMENTS, DUE DILIGENCE BY ANYONE, AFTER WHO YOU ARE THAT WANTS TO COME TO THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE AND OPEN A BUSINESS DOWNTOWN, THERE IS NO PARKING. YOU CAN'T PUT 500 CARS IN A FIVE SPACE PLACE. IT'S NOT OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE PARKING FOR THESE BUSINESSES THAT ARE COMING DOWNTOWN. IT'S UP TO THEM TO WORK OUT IT SOMEWHERE WITH THEIR EMPLOYEES, AND I DON'T LIKE HEARING TO THIS, NOT SAY BECAUSE OF THE HOMELESS, LETS QUIT BLAMING THE HOMELESS FOR EVERYTHING. MY LAST COMMENT IS, HOPE DECISIONS BY THIS COMMISSION ARE NOT DECIDED ON THE BASIS OF WHO SOMEONE THINKS THEY ARE, OR HOW THEY ARE CONNECTED IN THE CITY OF ST. AUGUSTINE. THAT WOULD BE D-I-S-C-R-I-M-I-N-A-T-I-O-N. IN A CASE, ANY YOUNG PEOPLE WOULD BE STREAMING THIS COMMISSION MEETING AFTER THIS MEETING, THE WORD IS DISCRIMINATION. WE ALL NEED TO BE TREATED THE SAME IN THIS CITY. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. I THINK THAT CONCLUDES PUBLIC COMMENT UNLESS THERE'S ANYONE ELSE WHO WANTS TO SPEAK? PUBLIC COMMENTS IS CLOSED. MR. WEEKS, YOUR UP, CAN YOU STATE YOUR CASE JUST LET ME PLEASE REMIND YOU THAT THE ARGUMENTS IS LIMITED TO THE RECORD BELOW, AND WE WILL HEAR NO NEW TESTIMONY OR EVIDENCE. >> [INAUDIBLE]. I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHAT THAT MEANS, BUT I'M GOING TO TRY MY BEST TO NOT INTRODUCE ANYTHING NEW BUT I HAVE TO SAY THIS. [01:00:04] I DO AGREE WITH MS. CLAYDE FOR ONCE. SHE SAYS IT'S NOT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO PROVIDE PARKING FOR DOWNTOWN BUSINESSES. I'M NOT ASKING YOU TO PROVIDE PARKING FOR DOWNTOWN BUSINESSES. I'M TRYING TO DO EXACTLY WHAT SHE SAID, DO IT ON MY OWN. SO FOR TONIGHT, I JUST WANT TO SAY, MR. CLAYDE I AGREE WITH YOU. I AM TRYING TO DO EXACTLY THAT, WHICH IS TO PROVIDE PARKING ON MY OWN PROPERTY FOR MY TENANTS. I APPRECIATE ALL OF YOU WHO DID SPEND A LITTLE BIT OF TIME WITH ME GIVING ME A CHANCE TO GO OVER THIS WITH YOU. I'M NOT GOING TO REHASH EVERYTHING UP UNTIL A COUPLE OF WEEKS AGO. I WAS TRYING TO FOLLOW ALL THE RULES, TRYING TO GO THROUGH THE PROPER CHANNELS, TRYING TO DO WHAT I'VE DONE IN THE PAST AS A COMMISSIONER AS A PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD MEMBER AS A HARP MEMBER AND GO THROUGH THE PROCEDURES JUST LIKE I WOULD EXPECT ANYONE ELSE TO DO. HARP PUT ON A CONDITION FOR ME THAT SAYS YOU CAN'T TEAR THE BUILDING DOWN UNTIL YOU HAVE NEW BUILDINGS DESIGNED. THAT'S ABOUT A HALF-A-MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF EFFORT AND IT'S A COUPLE OF YEARS MAYBE A YEAR PROCESS AT THIS POINT IN TIME IS BUSY AS EVERYBODY IS. I HAD A BUILDING THAT HAD TO COME DOWN. HARP SAYS, IF THE BUILDING IS UNSAFE, GET A LETTER FROM THE ENGINEER SUBMITTED TO THE BUILDING OFFICIAL. THE BUILDING OFFICIAL GOT THAT LETTER. THEY WENT OUT AND INSPECTED THE SITE AND THEY SAID THIS BUILDING IS DANGEROUS AND NEEDS TO COME DOWN IMMEDIATELY. SO THAT'S WHAT I DID. I TRIED TO GO THROUGH HARP FIRST, BUT THAT DIDN'T WORK. SO IN SPIRIT WITH PUBLIC SAFETY, I HAD THE CITY BUILDING OFFICIAL WITH THE ENGINEER'S SUPPORTS SAID THE BUILDING NEED TO COME DOWN AND IT'S NOW DOWN. I CAME TO PLANNING AND ZONING TO ASK PERMISSION TO USE THE EXISTING TWO PARKING LOT. I'M REALLY HAPPY TO SAY HOW SHOCKED THAT THIS HAS BEEN SO COMPLICATED. BUT THERE'S TWO EXISTING PARKING LOTS THAT HAVE BEEN THERE FOR 30 YEARS. THERE WAS A 2,500 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING IN THE MIDDLE. I'VE ASKED TO TAKE THE BUILDING DOWN, WHICH HAS NOW GONE. I WOULD LIKE TO TAKE THAT SPACE WHERE THE BUILDING WAS AND BEAUTIFY THE EXISTING PARKING LOT SO THAT IT LOOKS GOOD. I'VE SPENT ABOUT $8,000 IN ARCHITECTURAL PLANS FROM MARCUS HALL BACK, LATIMER PLUS HALL BACK TO COME UP WITH A NICE DESIGN. THAT DESIGN NEEDS, THE CITY LANDSCAPE REQUIREMENTS WITH PALM TREES, BUSHES, SHADE TREES, SO THAT IT LOOKS NICE. I HAVE FOUR ITEMS FOR VARIANCE. ONE OF THEM IS YOU CAN'T BE WITHIN 25 FT OF ANOTHER PARKING LOT. WELL, I CAN'T CHANGE THAT, THOSE PARKING LOT HAS BEEN THERE FOR 30 YEARS. THERE'S A 12-FOOT ALLEY IN-BETWEEN THEM AND I CAN'T WIDEN THE ALLEY. I CAN'T ASK MR. BAKER TO MOVE HIS PARKING AND I CAN'T MOVE MINE BECAUSE THE LOTS ARE 12 FEET APART, SO I'M STUCK WITH THAT. I DIDN'T CREATE THAT HARDSHIP. IT'S JUST THERE. ANOTHER ONE IS THE 25 PERCENT COMPACT CARS. AND THIS IS THE ONE I REALLY WANT TO ADDRESS. I'VE GOT SOME DEFINITIONS AND I'M NOT INTRODUCING ANYTHING NEW BECAUSE THIS IS IN THE CITY CODE. I'M ASSUMING BECAUSE IT'S IN THE CODE ITSELF FOR EVERYBODY AND I JUST WANT TO READ A COUPLE OF DEFINITIONS FOR YOU. PARKING AREA PRIVATE. MY LOT IS A PRIVATE LOT. PARKING AREA PRIVATE MEANS A PARKING AREA FOR THE PRIVATE USE OF THE OWNERS OR OCCUPANTS OF A LOT ON WHICH THE PARKING AREA IS LOCATED. THAT WOULD BE MY TENANTS. PUBLIC PARKING MEANS THE PARKING AREA AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC WITH OR WITHOUT COMPENSATION ARE USED TO ACCOMMODATE CLIENTS, CUSTOMERS, OR EMPLOYEES. NOW IT IS TRUE SOME EMPLOYEES PARK THERE. NEXT ONE'S ONE OF MY FAVORITE ONES. PARKING SPACE, COMPACT MEANS THAT SPACE AT LEAST EIGHT FEET BY 18 FEET INTO WHICH VEHICLES PARK. MOST COMMONLY WERE SPACES ASSIGNED OR TURNOVER IS MINIMAL. THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE, A PRIVATE PARKING LOT, MINIMAL TURNOVER, WHERE I CAN ASSIGN SMALL CARS TO SMALL SPACES. I'VE GOT THAT. I WANT TO NOTE ALSO THAT PART OF MY PARKING IS PARALLEL PARKING. JUST LIKE YOU SEE AROUND THE PLAZA ON GRANADA STREET ON A1A COMING INTO TOWN, ANYWHERE THERE'S PARALLEL PARKING, I WENT AROUND AND MEASURED PARKING SPACES. GUESS WHAT THE AVERAGE PARKING SPACE ALONG THE HIGHWAY IS, 7.5-8 FEET WIDE. NOW, I HAVE PARALLEL PARKING SPACES IN MY LOT. THEY'RE 8 FEET WIDE BY 18 FEET LONG. THAT'S A COMPACT SPACE, [01:05:01] BUT IT'S THE SAME WIDTH, IS HALF THE PARKING IN THE CITY. I ALSO HAD A WHOLE LOT OF PICTURES WHICH I DON'T KNOW IF YOU RECEIVED. I HAD THEM TO SHOW AT THE ZONING BOARD MEETING AND THE PROJECTOR WAS BROKEN. I AM GOING TO SHOW THEM TO YOU AGAIN TONIGHT. THEY ARE IN YOUR PACKAGE, BY THE WAY. NOT INTRODUCING ANYTHING NEW. [NOISE] I JUST WANT TO SHOW YOU THAT THAT'S HOW TALL THE STREET AND CALLE SITA ALLEY. THOSE HIGHLIGHTED BUILDINGS, EXCEPT FOR THE ONE ON THE FAR-LEFT DOESN'T. [OVERLAPPING] >> PLEASE SPEAK CLOSER TO THE MICROPHONE. [NOISE] >> HOLDING THIS OVER THERE. >> WELL, NOT LOST IT COMPLETELY. THANK YOU. HOW DO YOU CHIP IT IN? WELL, THAT'S OKAY. I'LL JUST TALK OVER HERE AND THIS IS THE ONLY ONE I NEED. [OVERLAPPING] YEAH, I GOT IT. ANYWAY, WHAT I'M TRYING TO SHOW YOU IS THIS AREA RIGHT HERE IS MY AREA OF QUESTIONAL PARKING. >> WE CAN'T SEE. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> SORRY. [LAUGHTER] >> YEAH, JUST LEAVE IT DOWN SO SHE SEES WHAT SHE'S SUPPOSED TO BE PROJECTING. HOW'S THAT? GIVE HER A SECOND. THERE YOU GO. SHE HAS ZOOMED IN FOR YOU. >> NO, I'M HOLDING IT. [OVERLAPPING] WHAT I WANT TO SHOW IS THIS. THIS IS MY OFFICE RIGHT HERE. THIS IS GARAGE. THIS IS THE BAD JUNKY, THIS IS THE GIFTED COURT. THIS IS A SPICE AND T EXCHANGE. THIS IS A FUTURE RESTAURANT WHICH I'M BUILDING RIGHT NOW. THIS IS MY PARKING LOT. THIS IS WHERE THE BUILDING 63 WAS AND THIS IS MY OTHER PARKING LOT. I HAVE TWO PARKING LOTS HERE AND MR. BAKER'S PARKING LOT RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET. BUT I WANT TO SHOW YOU THIS IS MY BLOCK RIGHT HERE THAT I'M ON. THIS IS A PARKING LOT OWNED BY THE BANK OF AMERICA. THIS HAS FIVE DIFFERENT PARKING LOTS RIGHT HERE ON SPANISH STREET. THIS IS MR. BAKER'S PARKING LOT ON SPANISH STREET. THIS IS THE COLUMBIA RESTAURANT PARKING LOT ON SPANISH STREET. THIS IS THE TOTES LOT OF HYPOLYTA. THIS IS THE WESTERN AUTO LOT WHICH WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THIS MORNING, MR. SPRINGFIELD. THAT'S THE WESTERN AUTO LOT. MY POINT IS THIS, I'M SURROUNDED BY PARKING LOTS. NONE OF THOSE PARKING LOTS HAVE THE LANDSCAPING REQUIREMENTS THAT THEY'RE REQUIRED TO HAVE. NONE OF THEM MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS THAT I'VE BEEN FORCED TO MEET AND YET THEY ARE IN EXISTENCE, THEY'RE DOING FINE. THEY'RE CHARGING $20 A DAY TO PARK THERE, AND THAT WAS RETURNED OVER SEVERAL TIMES A DAY. YET, I WANT TO PROVIDE A PARKING LOT WITH 28 SPACES ON TWO EXISTING PARKING LOTS WITH 25 SPACES BY INCREASING THE LANDSCAPING, HAVING A FEW SLIGHT VARIATIONS. THIS WILL BE THE NICEST PARKING LOT WITH AS FAR AS LANDSCAPING AND THINGS IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA. YET, I FEEL LIKE I'M BEING SINGLED OUT FOR PROVIDING SOMETHING THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE THAT THEY'RE USING FOR THE PUBLIC. I'M TRYING TO USE SOMETHING FOR MY TENANTS AND I'M BEING DENIED ONLY BECAUSE PEOPLE DON'T WANT PARKING DOWNTOWN. NOW, THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T WANT PARKING DOWNTOWN, IN MY OPINION, ARE PEOPLE WHO WANT US TO BE WILLIAMSBURG AND WE ARE NOT WILLIAMSBURG, WE ARE A LIVING, BREATHING CITY AND MY TENANTS ARE NOT IN THE TOURIST BUSINESS ALL OF THEM. THEY'RE NOT A BIG CORPORATION. THEY ARE LOCAL PEOPLE TRYING TO HAVE SMALL BUSINESSES. BECKY GEIGER AND HER HUSBAND HAVE A LITTLE BUSINESS, BAT CHUNKY THAT THEY'VE RUN FOR 10 YEARS, AND THEY PARKED IN THIS PARKING LOT FOR 10 YEARS. WE DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH PEOPLE. WE HAVE A PLACE TO PARK WHEN THEY COME IN, LIKE SHE SAYS ON THE 4 JULY, ANY DAY AND YOU TRY TO PARK, YOU CAN GO THERE BECAUSE YOU KNOW WHERE YOUR PARKING SPOT IS. YOU HAVE THE SAME SPOT EVERY SINGLE DAY. IF YOU HAVE A LITTLE CAR, YOU HAVE A LITTLE COMPACT SPACE. WHEN I'VE BEEN DENIED THIS VARIANCE BECAUSE I'M NOT MEETING THE 25 PERCENT COMPACT CAR REQUIREMENT AND WHEN YOU LOOK AROUND THIS TOWN, [01:10:03] VERY FEW PEOPLE MEET THE MINIMAL NUMBER OF 25 PERCENT. ALL I'M SAYING IS THE PARKING THAT YOU-ALL USE EVERY DAY IS COMPACT PARKING. I DON'T KNOW WHY A PRIVATE LOT CAN ONLY HAVE 50 PERCENT COMPACT SPACES. I KNOW IT'S IN THE CODE. I WOULD LIKE TO SAY WHILE I'M UP HERE, THAT WE SHOULD EXAMINE THE CODE BECAUSE THE CODE IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT IS DIFFERENT FROM A PUBLICS OR A HOME DEPOT PARKING LOT. IT NEEDS TO BE DIFFERENT. I'VE GOT THREE OTHER PARKING LOTS DOWNTOWN AND NONE OF THEM MEET THIS CODE, BUT YET, EVERY ONE OF THEM HAS GONE BEFORE THE CITY COMMISSION OR THE PLANNING AND ZONING AND OUR HUB, AND HAVE HAD VARIANCES AND HAVE HAD THOSE PARKING LOTS FOR 40 YEARS, AND THEY SUFFICE TO SATISFY THE NEEDS THAT I HAVE, THAT MY TENANT HAVE, AND THAT MY EMPLOYEES HAVE. ALL I'M ASKING US TO DO THE SAME THING AND BEAUTIFY A HORRIBLE LOOKING SITUATION THAT WE HAD DOWNTOWN. I DON'T LIKE IT. I DON'T WANT IT. BUT I'M BEING FORCED TO DO THAT, IF YOU GUYS DON'T GRANT ME THIS VARIANCE. I'M NOT GOING TO SAY THAT THE PLANNING ZONING BOARD HERE. I DON'T AGREE WITH THEIR DECISION. I DID NOT HAVE ALL THIS INFORMATION TO SHARE WITH THEM THAT I HAVE TO SHARE WITH YOU TONIGHT. YET, THE BASIS IS STILL THERE. THERE'S FOUR ITEMS THAT THEY SAID THAT I DIDN'T DO AND THEY DENIED THEM ON THOSE BASES AND I'M SAYING THAT I'VE MET 95 PERCENT OF THE INTENT OF THOSE FOUR ITEMS. NUMBER 1, I CAN'T MOVE MR. BAKERS IN MY PARKING LOT. I CANNOT WIDEN THE ALLEY. THAT ONE IS NOT MY FAULT. IT JUST EXIST. THE FACT THAT I WANT TO HAVE A FEW MORE COMPACT CARS IN A PRIVATE PARKING LOT. YES, I'M ASKING FOR THAT. I DON'T THINK IT'S A BIG REQUEST. I'M ASKING ALSO TO KEEP MY RAILING AND EXPAND THAT LANDSCAPING AND MAKE IT LOOK PRETTY ACROSS THERE. IN HINDSIGHT AND TONIGHT, I THINK THAT'S ALL I NEED TO SAY. AS YOU ALL KNOW ME, YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH THE SITE, YOU'VE SEEN WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE NOW. [NOISE] IN THE LAST PICTURE, THAT'S WHAT WILL LOOK LIKE, THE TREES AND THE FRONT. >> BUT WE ARE NOT SEEING IT. >> YOU WANT TO SEE THAT AGAIN? >> JUST GIVE IT A LITTLE MINUTE. THERE YOU GO. >> THANK YOU. FROM HYPOLITA STREET, WHEN YOU DRIVE DOWN THE STREET, PART OF WHAT ONE OF THE BOARD SAID WAS THAT'S NOT TO PEDESTRIAN SCALE. WELL, I DISAGREE WITH THAT. I THINK THAT HAVING SOME LANDSCAPING THERE WITH A LITTLE NONDESCRIPT FENCE TO KEEP PEOPLE FROM DRIVING IN AND OUT, WHICH IS WHAT THEY DID BEFORE I PUT THAT RAILING UP THERE HAS WORKED VERY WELL. PEOPLE DON'T DRIVE THROUGH THERE, BUT BEFORE I PUT THAT UP THERE, THEY WOULD JUST CUT THE CURB AND RUN INTO THE PARKING LOT. IT IS A CONSTANT PROBLEM FOR US TO DEAL WITH PARKING. SO I NEED TO DO SOMETHING TO MAKE IT SAFE, SECURE, LOOK BETTER, AND SERVE OUR NEEDS. I JUST WANTED TO SHOW YOU BECAUSE THESE WERE ALL PRESENTED AT THE PLANNING ZONING BOARD MEETING, I WAS GOING TO HAVE, BUT SINCE IT DIDN'T MAKE IT THROUGH PLANNING AND ZONING, I WITHDREW THAT REQUEST. ANYWAY, THAT'S IT. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND CONGRATULATIONS TO THE DUNE AND COMMISSIONERS. >> I HAVE A QUESTION. >> OKAY. >> I WENT OVER THERE AND LOOKED AT THE PARKING LOT AND I NOTICED WHERE THE [INAUDIBLE] THERE'S A LOT OF ROUGH EDGE, ARE YOU GOING TO PUT SOME EDGES OUT OR A WALL OR SOMETHING THERE BECAUSE IT EASES THEIR AREA AND [INAUDIBLE] COULD SEE ON THE SIDE OF THAT? >> DO YOU SEE THAT? THIS IS [INAUDIBLE] RIGHT HERE. I'VE GOT A FENCE THAT GOES ALONG THERE AND LANDSCAPING, THERE'S TREES, SHADE TREES. THERE'S HEDGES ACROSS THE FRONT AND ON THE SIDE AND ON THE ALLEY. THERE IS A SOLID WALL RIGHT ALONG THIS THING AND THERE'S BUILDINGS HERE. THERE IS MUCH LANDSCAPING THEN AS I CAN. >> ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. >> DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. WEEKS BEFORE WE GO TO PUBLIC COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS? MR. WEEKS, THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE. >> YOU'RE WELCOME. THANK YOU. >> I WANTED TO JUST BE CLEAR ON THE RECORD. HOW MANY MAXIMUM ADDITIONAL PARKING STATIONS WOULD YOU PUT THERE IN THE AREAS THAT YOU'VE APPEALED? >> THREE. >> THREE? MAXIMUM? >> IT GOES FROM 25-28. >> RIGHT, I WANTED TO BE CLEAR ON THAT EXCEPT THREE SPACES WON'T SOLVE OUR DOWNTOWN PARKING PROBLEM. PROBABLY 50 WOULDN'T. BUT I'M JUST WANTING TO BE CLEAR ON THAT. >> THREE SPACES WOULD GIVE ME THE BENEFIT TO WHEN I HAVE A TENANT TO [01:15:05] RENT MY NEW BUILDING ON SPANISH STREET TO PROVIDE THOSE MANAGERS WITH FREE PARKING SPACES. >> THOSE THREE SPACES. THANK YOU. THEN THE SECOND IS I READ THE TRANSCRIPTS OF THE BOARD MEETING. I READ THE TRANSCRIPT IN THE KGB MEETING. I READ ALL OF THE STAFF NOTATIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS IN OUR CODE AND OUR COMP PLAN. WHAT I WANT TO UNDERSTAND IS THAT FREE DEVELOPMENT IS ONE OF THE MAJOR INTENTIONS OF WHAT CONSTRAINTS YOU'RE UNDER IN THIS APPLICATION AND THIS APPEAL IN THAT WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP THE INTEGRITY OF THE CITY AND NOT PATCHWORK IT WITH PARKING LOTS. I THINK WHAT YOU HAVE STATED BEFORE OR AT LEAST THE IDEA HAS BEEN THAT YOU'RE GOING TO REDEVELOP ALL THREE OF THESE, ALL THE TWO OLDER BUILDINGS THAT WERE DEMOLISHED BACK IN 91 OR SOMETHING, AND THEN THIS PARKING LOT TOO, IF IT WERE TO GO FOR REVIEW, WOULD BE DEVELOPED. THIS IS A LONG-WIND WAY OF ASKING, WHAT IS YOUR TIMELINE? >> MY HONEST ANSWER IS I DON'T KNOW. I CAN SAY THIS AND I DON'T KNOW WHY IT'S NOT POPPING UP ON THE SCREEN AGAIN, BUT I'VE GOT A SITE PLAN THAT I DEVELOPED IN 1990 WITH JERRY DIXON. THIS WAS THE SITE PLAN THAT WE DEVELOPED AFTER I ACQUIRED A STANDARD RUNNING PROPERTY, AS WELL AS THE PARKING LOT THAT'S ON CALLE SITA, THIS PIECE WHERE MY FINGER IS RIGHT HERE. WE HAVE 1, 2, 3, 4 BUILDINGS DESIGNED FOR THAT SITE. I ALSO HAVE ANOTHER PLAN WHICH I DIDN'T BRING WITH ME TONIGHT, WHICH SHOWS MY WHOLE SIDE OF THE STREET. IF YOU COULD PICTURE WHAT'S DOWN THERE ON THE END OF ST. GEORGE STREET AT FRAZIER'S BUILT, MAYBE A LITTLE SMALLER SCALE WITH THE INTERTWINED COURTYARDS AROUND KILWINS THAT'S WHAT I'M PLANNING TO DO HERE. >> BUT YOU DON'T HAVE A TIMELINE. >> I'VE GOT THREE PROJECTS I'M WORKING ON THE CITY RIGHT NOW, WHICH WILL PROBABLY TAKE TWO OR THREE YEARS. I DON'T FORESEE THAT I CAN DEVELOP THIS 4, 5, MAYBE 10 YEARS, BUT IT IS IN MY PLANS THAT THIS IS GOING TO BE BUILT. I DO NOT WANT THIS TO BE A PERMANENT PARKING LOT. I DON'T MAKE ANY MONEY OFF THIS PARKING LOT, BY THE WAY, IT JUST COST ME MONEY. IF I COULD BUILD THE BUILDINGS THERE, I WOULD. >> THANK YOU. I APPRECIATE THAT ANSWER. >> ANY MORE QUESTIONS FROM COMMISSIONERS? ALL RIGHT. WE WILL MOVE [INAUDIBLE] NEXT WEEK. >> WE'VE ALREADY DONE PUBLIC COMMENT, I BELIEVE. >> OUTLINES AS [OVERLAPPING] [INAUDIBLE] >> I KNOW, WE JUMPED AROUND A LITTLE BIT, BUT I BELIEVE UNLESS I'M WRONG, MAYBE OUR CLERK CAN CONFIRM. >> WE'VE HAD PUBLIC COMMENT. >> PUBLIC COMMENT HAS BEEN DONE. >> INSTRUCTIONS YOU GAVE US ARE FOR TWO PUBLIC COMMENTS. I SUPPOSE IT INTO MY DISCRETION, DO WE HAVE ANYONE HERE THAT WANTS TO SPEAK AGAIN? >> BENJAMIN BRANDOW, 4420 CARTER ROAD. THIS IS JUST ME TRYING TO THROW OUT A CREATIVE SOLUTION BECAUSE MR. WEEKS REALLY DOESN'T WANT TO HAVE A PARKING LOT THERE, BUT HE'S WILLING TO INVEST A SERIOUS AMOUNT OF MONEY TO MAKE IT PRETTY WELL WHILE HE WAITS HIS 5-10 YEARS TO HAVE WHAT IS IDEALLY BEST SITUATION FOR EVERYBODY. MAYBE WE CAN COME UP WITH A SOLUTION WHERE HE DOESN'T EVEN NEED TO MAKE THIS INVESTMENT AND WE CAN JUST PUT UP UNINTERPRETED MURAL AS A CONSTRUCTION SIGN. EVERYBODY CAN BE EXCITED ABOUT WHAT'S TO COME. WE CAN MAYBE HIGHLIGHT THE NORC AND CULTURE WHICH IS PREVALENT ON THAT STREET AND COME UP WITH SOMETHING THAT WILL BE BENEFICIAL IN THE LONG RUN. WE CAN HAVE MORE THAN THREE ADDITIONAL SPOTS FOR REALLY NO ADDITIONAL MONEY BECAUSE IF WE WERE REALLY DOUBLING THE SIZE OF THAT PARKING LOT, BUT WE'RE ONLY GETTING THREE MORE SPOTS, IT'S REALLY AN INEFFICIENT SOLUTION THAT HE'S COME UP WITH BEING CONSTRAINED TO SOME CODES THAT MAY NOT BE IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY. MAYBE WE CAN COME AROUND AND DO SOMETHING THAT IS CREATIVE AND WILL NOT ONLY SOLVE THE PROBLEM, IT WILL GIVE US MORE PARKING SPOTS. WE'LL ALSO HAVE A NEW INTERPRETIVE EXHIBIT WHICH CELEBRATES ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT CULTURES TO ST. AUGUSTINE BECAUSE WITHOUT THEM, WE WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN CONTINUOUSLY OCCUPIED AND WE WOULDN'T BE THE OLDEST CITY IN THE NATION. IT WOULD BE AN OPPORTUNITY TO LET THESE PEOPLE KNOW THAT THEY ARE RESPECTED IN THIS TOWN AND IT WOULD HELP MR. WEEKS SAVE THAT MONEY FOR THE REAL DEVELOPMENT THAT HE WANTS US TO PUT SOMETHING PHENOMENAL THERE. WE DO HAVE A MAJOR PROBLEM WITH PARKING. MAYBE THERE'S SOME PUBLIC PRIVATE THINGS THAT WE CAN BEGIN TALKING [01:20:02] ABOUT WITH ALL OF THOSE PARKING LOTS IN THE AREA AND MAYBE COME UP WITH SOMETHING MORE COHESIVE WHERE EVERYBODY CAN BENEFIT. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. ANY MORE QUESTIONS FROM CITY COMMISSIONERS? WE ARE DONE WITH PUBLIC COMMENTS. WE'RE IN COMMISSIONERS' COMMENTS. >> YES, GUYS. THANK YOU. I ACTUALLY WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS TO STAFF BEFORE GIVING OTHER PEOPLE THAT OPPORTUNITY, [INAUDIBLE] IS THAT OKAY? I'M REFERRING TO ONE OF THE NOTATIONS FROM STAFF REGARDING THE PCBS DECISION AND THAT THEIR DECISION TO REPORT CODE WAS BASED IN PART ON THE REQUEST NOT BEING A SINGULAR DISADVANTAGE. FOR MY EDIFICATION, IT IS ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS IN APPROVAL WITHIN ACCOUNTANT APPLICATION FOR VARIANCE, RIGHT? >> YES. >> FOR MY APPLICATION, COULD YOU PROVIDE AN EXAMPLE THAT HELP ME BETTER UNDERSTAND WHAT A SINGULAR DISADVANTAGE WOULD BE? >> FOR EXAMPLE IF IT RELATES TO THE LAND OR THE PROPERTY, IF A PIECE OF PROPERTY IS TRIANGULAR IN SHAPE AND IT MAKES IT DIFFICULT TO MEET THE SETBACKS OR SOMETHING BECAUSE OF THE UNIQUE SHAPE OF A PIECE OF PROPERTY THEN IT'S RELATED TO THAT SINGULAR PIECE OF PROPERTY, IT'S NOT A GENERAL RULE THROUGHOUT THE AREA. >> THANK YOU. THAT HELPS. I THINK THAT WAS MY ONLY QUESTION TO THE STAFF RIGHT NOW. >> OKAY. ANYONE ELSE? I COULD ASSUME JUST ONE COMMENT I HAVE HERE OR TAKE BACK OUR DELIBERATIONS IS THAT I THINK THAT YOU'D HAVE TO ASSUME THIS PARKING LOT [INAUDIBLE] JUST WANTED TO MAKE THAT COMMENT. THAT'S A REALLY CLEAR ANSWER. >> I THINK YOU'RE PROBABLY RIGHT BECAUSE THE TWO OTHER PARKING LOT WERE INITIALLY PASSED AS TEMPORARY ANOTHER 30 YEARS. WHILE THIS ONE I THINK HAS BEEN REFERRED TO AS BEING TEMPORARY, I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT AND WE'VE SEEN RECENTLY, GIVEN THAT THIS TREATMENT. >> IT ALSO MAKES HIM THAT HE COULD SELL IT TOMORROW. [INAUDIBLE] HE WOULD BE OUT OF THE PICTURE AND COULDN'T COME HOME. HE COULD DEVELOP A PARKING LOT AND THEN SELL THE PROPERTY, CORRECT? >> I THINK YOU SHOULD PROBABLY DIRECT THAT QUESTION TO YOUR PLANNING DIRECTOR. HE CAN ADDRESS WHETHER OR NOT IT COULD BE A STANDALONE PUBLIC PARKING LOT. >> IT COULD BE SOLD. WE DO HAVE PUBLIC PARKING LOTS IN THE AREA. THAT'S NOT THE INTENTION OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. THE CITY'S INTENTION, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, OF NOT REQUIRING PARKING IN THE DOWNTOWN IS TO DISCOURAGE DEMOLITION TO CREATE PARKING LOTS, AND ALSO TO ENCOURAGE THE INFILL DEVELOPMENT OR VACANT PARKING LOT. THIS PROPERTY IN QUESTION, HE'S SUBMITTED AN APPLICATION TO CHANGE THE EXISTING SITUATION IN THAT, THAT IS WHAT LED TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD MEETING AND OUR STAFF REPORT, AND THE BOARD'S DECISION TO DENY IT. >> BUT THE HEART OF THE MATTER IS FOR THE THREE ACTUAL VARIANCES. ONE WAS COMPACT CARS. COULD YOU [INAUDIBLE] AGAIN? >> YES, I WILL. >> [INAUDIBLE] A GOOD FINDING YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND THOSE AND UNDERSTAND WHETHER THE COMMISSION AND WHETHER THE EXAMINING BOARD AIRED IN THEIR DECISION IN FINDING THAT THOSE WERE NOT JUST RUNNING. >> YES. [NOISE]. HE LIKED ME. I ALSO HAVE SOME ILLUSTRATIONS THAT I CAN WALK YOU THROUGH THAT WOULD HELP. [01:25:10] THIS IS THE DRAWING OF RECORD THAT WAS SUBMITTED IN 1992 WHEN THE ORIGINAL PARKING LOT WAS APPROVED. IT HAD EIGHT PARKING SPACES ALONG THIS EDGE HERE. OVER TIME THE PROPERTY HAS EVOLVED. I'M NOT SURE OF THE ACTUAL EVOLUTION OF IT, BUT THEY'RE NOW ARE ALSO PARKING SPACES ON THIS SIDE AND THIS IS THE EXISTING BUILDING. THIS IS THE CALLE SITA PARKING LOT THAT MR. WEEKS REFERS TO. OVER TIME, THOSE PARKING LOTS HAVE EVOLVED. NOW THERE ARE 17 PARKING SPACES IN HERE AS I UNDERSTAND IT, AND THERE ARE EIGHT PARKING SPACES AS MR. WEEKS REPRESENTED AT THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD OVER IN THIS CORNER AT THE CALLE SITA PARKING LOT. HE CAME INTO US TO DEMOLISH THIS BUILDING AND TO RECONFIGURE THE PARKING LOT INTO HIS PLAN WHICH I CAN BRING UP FOR YOU BECAUSE HE WAS MODIFYING THE EXISTING CIRCUMSTANCES. WE REVIEWED IT ACCORDING TO THE CODE. YOU CAN PROVIDE PARKING AND YOU CAN HAVE A PARKING LOT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS, BUT IF YOU DO, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO MEET THE CODE. THERE ARE FOUR VARIANCES THAT WERE REQUESTED. THAT NUMBER 1, HE WAS EXPANDING THE PARKING LOT. THERE'S A LIMITATION OF 20 PARKING SPACES FOR PARKING LOTS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS. EVEN THOUGH THE 17 AND THE EIGHT CONSTITUTE 25, HE WAS EXPANDING IT TO 28 PARKING SPACES. THAT'S AN EXPANSION OF THE EXISTING USE AND IT'S OVER AND ABOVE 20 PARKING SPACES. YOU NEEDED A VARIANCE FOR THAT. >> MAY I INTERRUPT? >> YES. >> CAN YOU DO THE MATH AGAIN ONLY ON THAT, HE HAD [OVERLAPPING]? >> HE HAD 17 AND EIGHT FOR 25 PARKING SPACES THAT WE CONSIDERED EXISTING. HE'S REQUESTING 28 PARKING SPACES. [BACKGROUND]. >> [OVERLAPPING] LACK OF THREE SPACES [OVERLAPPING]. >> THAT'S THE BASIS FOR NEEDING A VARIANCE TO EXCEED 20. I KNOW IT SOUNDS A LITTLE FUNNY, BUT HE IS TAKING 25 AND ADDING THREE. THAT AGAIN, IS ABOVE 20 PARKING SPACES, WHICH IS THE LIMITATION IN THE CODE. WE SAID THAT HE NEEDED A VARIANCE FOR THAT. >> I THOUGHT YOU SAID THAT IT WAS 25, IT'S THE LIMIT. [BACKGROUND] >> HE HAD EXISTING 25. HE WAS ASKING FOR 28. >> HE WAS ASKING TO EXPAND THE NON-CONFORMING UNITS? YES. FOR PARKING LOTS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. THERE'S ALSO A DISTANCE LIMITATION THAT YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE WITHIN 25 FEET OF ANOTHER PARKING FACILITY. WE CONSIDER THE PARKING FACILITY BEHIND THE BILLY BAKER BUILDING OR THE THOMPSON BAKER BUILDING. IN EXISTING FACILITY, HE'S WITHIN 25 FEET AND HE'S EXPANDING HIS NON-CONFORMING PARKING LOT. SO WE CONSIDERED HE NEEDED A VARIANCE FOR THAT. AS WELL, IN HIS RECONFIGURATION, YOU ARE LIMITED TO 25 PERCENT COMPACT PARKING SPACES. OF YOUR TOTAL NUMBER OF PARKING SPACES THAT YOU'RE PROVIDING HE'S PROPOSING 50 PERCENT OF THE PARKING SPACES BE COMPACT. IT WAS A VARIANCE TO EXCEED THE 25 PERCENT LIMITATION ON THE COMPACT CARS. THEN WITH THE CONFIGURATION AND AS HE MENTIONED THAT THERE WERE PARALLEL PARKING SPACES PROPOSED ALONG CALLE SITA, THAT WAS THE VARIANCE FOR THE DRIVE AISLE, THERE'S NO DRIVE AISLE ON SITE FOR THE PARALLEL PARKING SPACES ALONG CALLE SITA. BASICALLY, AND I'LL BRING UP THE CONFIGURATION THAT THEY WOULD USE CALLE SITA FOR THE MANEUVERABILITY SPACE, FOR THE PARALLEL PARKING SPACES. THAT'S WHY WE SAID HE NEEDED A VARIANCE TO THE DRIVE AISLES. THOSE WERE THE FOUR VARIANCES THAT WERE AT QUESTION AT THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD. LET ME BRING UP HIS PROPOSED PLAN. [BACKGROUND]. >> I HAVE A QUESTION, DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY SPACES ARE ON THE BAKER LOT? >> NO, I DO NOT OFFHAND. [01:30:01] THOSE ARE EXISTING PARKING LOTS AS LONG AS THEY CONTINUE TO EXIST, THEN THEY CAN CONTINUE AS THEY ARE. IF SOMEONE WERE TO COME IN AND PROPOSE TO CHANGE SOMETHING ABOUT THOSE PARKING LOTS, THEN THEY WOULD NEED TO BRING THE PARKING LOTS UP TO CODE. >> WHEN WERE THESE PARKING LOT CODES DEVELOPED? >> I'M SORRY. >> WHAT WERE THE YEARS THEY WOULD DEVELOP THE CURRENT CODE? >> THE PARKING CODE HAS BEEN IN PLACE FOR A LONG TIME. THE GENERAL ZONING CODE WAS PUT IN PLACE IN 1975. I'M NOT SURE SPECIFICALLY FOR THE PARKING CODE IS, BUT IT HAS BEEN INTACT FOR THE 30 YEARS THAT I'M AWARE OF. >> SO HE CUT HIS PARKING LOT IN 1992 OUTSIDE OF THE CODE? >> AS HE STATED, THERE MAY HAVE BEEN VARIANCES APPLIED FOR OVER THE YEARS THAT HE WAS GRANTED. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE- >> MS. SKINNER [INAUDIBLE]. THERE'S FOUR PARKING PLACES THAT ARE USING THE CALLE SITA ALLEY. >> YES, THESE ARE THE PARALLEL PARKING SPACES THAT WERE REFERRED TO. THIS IS THE ALLEY. THERE'S ALSO PARALLEL SPOTS HERE. THIS PLAN DOESN'T HAVE THE DIMENSIONS ON IT, BUT IT WAS THESE ARE GOING TO BE RECONFIGURED. IF YOU HAVE 90-DEGREE PARKING LIKE THIS, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE 24 FEET BEHIND THEM. PARALLEL PARKING SPACES YOU NEED ROOM TO MANEUVER IN AND OUT. YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE 24 FEET BEHIND THESE AS WELL. THEN THESE ARE THE PARALLELS SPOTS. IN TOTAL, THIS PLAN SHOWS 28 PARKING SPACES. >> MS. SKINNER, IF YOU DON'T MIND, COULD YOU GO OVER THE CRITERIA FOR GRANTING A VARIANCE? [BACKGROUND]. >> THE WRITING IS, THE TYPE IS A LITTLE BIT SMALL. THERE ARE FOUR CRITERIA FOR GRANTING A VARIANCE. FIRST OF ALL, THE PARTICULAR PROPERTY BECAUSE OF SIZE, SHAPE, TOPOGRAPHY, AND OTHER PHYSICAL CONDITIONS, SUFFERS A SINGULAR DISADVANTAGE TO THE OPERATION OF THIS SECTION, WHICH DISADVANTAGE DOES NOT APPLY TO OTHER PROPERTIES IN THE VICINITY. B, I HAVE HIGHLIGHTED IT IN RED BECAUSE THIS IS ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT THE BOARD FELT THAT IT DID NOT MEET THE THRESHOLD. BECAUSE OF THIS DISADVANTAGE, THE OWNER IS UNABLE TO MAKE REASONABLE USE OF THE AFFECTED PROPERTY. THEN C, THIS DISADVANTAGE DOES NOT EXIST BECAUSE OF CONDITIONS CREATED BY THE OWNER OR APPLICANT, AND THEN D, GRANT OF THE VARIANCE WILL NOT BE CONTRARY TO THE PUBLIC INTERESTS, WILL NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT OTHER PROPERTY IN THE VICINITY, AND WILL NOT BE IN HARMONY WITH THE SPIRIT, INTENT, AND PURPOSE OF THIS SECTION. THE BOARD FOUND THAT GRANTING THE VARIANCE WAS NOT IN THE PUBLIC INTEREST. >> [INAUDIBLE] I SEE THAT ALLEY, THAT'S A PUBLIC ROAD? >> YES. >> I JUST HEARD YOU SAY THAT THE DRIVE ALLEY ON THE INTERIOR OF THE PROPERTY AS DESIGNED DON'T NEED THE WIDTHS IF NECESSARY. IS THAT CORRECT? I HEARD TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. [NOISE]. [BACKGROUND]. >> THIS DOES SHOW SOME OF THE DIMENSIONS. IT DOES SHOW 24 FEET HERE AND 24 FEET HERE. THERE'S 22.7 FEET HERE ACCORDING TO THE PLAN. EXCUSE MY HANDS. >> THAT WILL BE 13 [INAUDIBLE]. >> FIFTEEN FEET HERE. THERE'S NOTHING ON SITE AS FAR AS THIS PARKING, I'LL TRY TO HOLD IT BETTER. [01:35:08] I WOULD COMMENT THAT THIS IS ALSO A 90 DEGREES SPOT, SO I DON'T KNOW IF IT WOULD BE ORIENTED TO PEOPLE BACKING OUT THIS WAY OR ORIENTED FOR PEOPLE TO BE BACKING OUT THIS WAY. THESE ARE SOME OF THE QUESTIONS THAT WE HAD. THERE WOULD NOT BE A FULL 24 FEET BETWEEN THE END OF THIS PART AND THIS PARALLEL SPOT. >> ISN'T THAT A ONE-WAY? >> [INAUDIBLE] ANSWER THE QUESTIONS. >> IN THIS SESSION, WE WILL ASK [INAUDIBLE]. [NOISE] >> WOULD YOU PULL THAT UP A LITTLE BIT AGAIN, THE CENTER OF THAT SHOW? BECAUSE THAT APPEARS TO BE COMING INTO THE PARKING. YOU WOULD PARK TO THE LEFT AND THEN YOU WOULD DRIVE FORWARDS [INAUDIBLE] SO THAT YOU'RE GOING IN THE DIRECTION OF THE ARROW. THERE'S NO BACKING UP TO THAT PARTICULAR [INAUDIBLE] SPOTS OR FIVE, I CAN'T TAKE IT OUT. >> IT IS ONE WAY IN AND OUT. [NOISE] ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NEW SCANNER BEFORE I WANT TO INVITE MR. WEEKS TO COME BACK AND READ THAT. SHE'S TOO WORRIED TO QUESTIONS. [OVERLAPPING] WE HAVE OPPORTUNITY FOR THE COMMENT. >> THANK YOU. I JUST WANT TO SAY THAT WE'VE TRIED TO MAKE THIS TO FILL THE CODE. ALL THE DRY BULB WIDTHS ARE CORRECT. I HAD NO IDEA WHEN THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT THE DRY BULB WIDTH NOT BEING WIDE. I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT BUT AMY JUST CLARIFIED THIS IS THE ALLEY. BUT THAT'S THE SAME THING AS YOU HAVE OUT HERE. IT'S THE SAME THING ALL AROUND TOWN AS YOU HAVE A STREET WITH PARALLEL PARKING. I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW I'M GETTING PENALIZED OR THE THOUGHT OF GETTING PENALIZED FOR PROVIDING THIS SAME EXACT THING THAT'S ALL OVER THE CITY. I MEAN, THERE'S PARALLEL PARKING EVERYWHERE AND THIS ALLEY, I'VE GOT FOUR CARS PARKED IN THERE. IT'S BEEN THERE FOR YEARS AND IT'S NEVER BEEN A PROBLEM. IT MAY NOT MEET THE CODE FOR A PARKING LOT, BUT NEITHER DOES THE PARKING ON THE STREET OUT HERE. IT'S NOT A PARKING LOT. IT'S JUST IT'S A STREET WITH PARKING ON IT, AND THAT'S THE SAME THING THAT IS HERE. THIS HAS BEEN BROUGHT UP TO CODE. I SPENT A LOT OF TIME AND MONEY DEVELOPING THIS SO THAT IT WOULD BE EFFICIENT, IT WOULDN'T BE OVERCROWDED, THAT IT WOULD MEET ALL THE CODES EXCEPT FOR THESE FEW LITTLE THINGS THAT I THINK THESE ARE VERY MINOR DETAILS ON THIS. >> DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER COMMENTS? >> WE'RE READY TO GET THAT. >> JUST THE FACT THAT I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY, THE PARKING LOTS ARE THERE. THERE'S A HOLE IN THE MIDDLE THAT WAS BROUGHT UP BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD. I DON'T WANT TO SEE A HOLE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET. I WANT TO MAKE IT LOOK BETTER. I WANT TO MAKE IT LOOK BETTER AND FUNCTION BETTER, AND I WOULD ASK YOUR HELP TO DO THAT. I KNOW YOU'RE ASKING ME, "HOW LONG IS IT GOING TO BE?" I DON'T KNOW. IT WON'T BE 30 YEARS. THIS IS NOT WORTH IT, BUT I WILL SAY AND I HOPE THAT THE CITY IS WORKING ON A MOBILITY PLAN. I DO HOPE THAT FINALLY, AFTER MANY YEARS OF TALKING ABOUT THIS, THERE IS GOING TO BE A PLAN THAT WOULD HELP ME AND EMPLOYEES AND PEOPLE IN THE DOWNTOWN. WE CAN'T JUST DESIGN EVERYTHING FOR TOURISTS. >> THANK YOU, MR. WEEKS. BLONDER, [INAUDIBLE]. >> I FIRST WANTED TO RESPOND TO MR.WEEKS, AND I APPRECIATE YOUR FRUSTRATION AND YOUR HARD WORK AND I THINK YOUR INTENTIONS ARE VERY GOOD. BUT I DON'T BELIEVE YOU ARE BEING SINGLED OUT BY EITHER THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD OR THE STAFF. YOUR SITUATION IS DIFFERENT. YOU HAD A BUILDING THAT BECAME DECREPIT, IT WENT THROUGH ALL OF THE HISTORICAL REVIEWS. YOU DID ALL THE RIGHT THINGS. NOBODY IS ACCUSING YOU OF THAT. BUT WHAT THAT DID WAS OPEN UP AN OPPORTUNITY FOR YOU THAT YOU CAN'T AT THIS TIME FULFILL BY REDEVELOPING. SO AS IT ACTUALLY TOOK A TEMPORARY MEASURE, YOU HAVE APPLIED FOR A VARIANCE SUDDENLY, THAT'S WHAT YOU DID. AS A RESULT OF APPLYING FOR THAT VARIANCE, IT TRIPPED ALL OF THESE FOUR DIFFERENT CRITERIA. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE REALLY DISCUSSING AND I'M NOT FINISHED WITH MY COMMENTS. I'M JUST ADDRESSING WHAT YOU HAD SAID EARLIER. I'D APPRECIATE IT IF WE TAKE ANY FURTHER COMMENTS FROM YOU LATER WHEN I'M FINISHED. [OVERLAPPING]. >> NOW WE'RE CLEAR FOR AN ELABORATION NOW, MR. WEEKS. >> I DO APPRECIATE ALL OF YOUR ATTENTIONS AND I UNDERSTAND YOUR CONSTRAINTS, BUT THIS IS A DIFFERENT SITUATION THAN ALL THE OTHER PARKING LOTS THAT YOU RECRUIT. YOU HAVE APPLIED FOR A VARIANCE AND THAT'S [01:40:02] A REQUIREMENT OF DOING THE WORK AND MAKING THIS PARKING LOT. I HAVE A COUPLE MORE COMMENTS [INAUDIBLE]. [OVERLAPPING] THE FIRST IS THAT THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD DELIBERATED AT LENGTH AND THAT'S WHY THEY HAD A DISAGREEMENT. IT WASN'T A UNANIMOUS VOTE. [INAUDIBLE] HOW YOU ALL REQUEST TO BE ACCOMMODATED FOR A VARIANCE. ONE OF THE SUGGESTIONS THAT WAS MADE WAS TO CONDITION A VARIANCE ON A TIMELINE FOR REDEVELOPMENT SO THAT THIS TEMPORARY PARKING LOT AFTER FIVE YEARS, FOR EXAMPLE, MIGHT THEN BECOME A DONOR DEVELOPMENT APPROVAL PROCESS. FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, MS. LOPEZ, NO CONDITIONS CAN BE PUT ON A VARIANCE, IS THAT CORRECT? >> THAT IS CORRECT. IT IS DIFFERENT THAN IT USED BY EXCEPTION THAT CAN HAVE CONDITIONS. >> THANK YOU. THAT DOOR HAD TO BE CLOSED. THEY TRIED TO BE CONSTRUCTIVE AND ACCOMMODATING BUT BY LAW, THAT DOOR HAD TO BE CLOSED, AND THAT IN PART LEADS TO THE DECISION I'LL END UP HAVING TO MAKE. BUT THE STAFF IN THEIR REPORT AND RECOMMENDATIONS AND REFERRING TO I THINK IT'S PAGE 135, THE DIGITAL AGENDA. I'D LIKE TO JUST READ THESE OUT LOUD, SOME OF THESE BECAUSE I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT FOR THE CONTEXT. THE MEASURES THAT ARE IN OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND IN OUR CODE IN OUR HISTORIC DOWNTOWN AREA, I'M PREFACING THIS AND NOW I'LL QUOTE, "PRIMARILY, THESE ARE MEASURES INTENDED TO PRESERVE THE CHARACTER AND HISTORIC ASSETS OF THE DOWNTOWN, RATHER THAN LET THEM SLIP AWAY AND TRANSFORM INTO A COPY OF SUBURBAN COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT IN THE STRIP MALLS AND BIG BOX SCORES." NOW I AM NOT INFERRING, I'M JUST READING, OKAY? THAT IS SOMETHING THAT COULD BE INFERRED WITHOUT OUR PROTECTIONS OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, OUR FUTURE LAND USE MAP, ALL OF THE COORDINATES AND CODES WE'VE WORKED SO HARD. IN FACT, MY PREDECESSORS HAVE WORKED SO HARD TO ESTABLISH AND MAINTAIN. FURTHER QUOTING, "THE EXISTENCE AND LAND LOAD EXPANSION OF A PARKING FACILITY FOSTERS AUTOMOBILE DEPENDENCY ON RESIDENTS AND TOURISTS ALIKE." I WILL ADD, WE DO HAVE A MOBILITY PLAN. STAFF WORKED HARD ON THIS CONDITION PRIOR TO THE TWO NEWER MEMBERS, RETIRED AND APPROVED IT LAST SPRING. WE HAVE IT AND IT'S IN PROCESS, AND WE'VE MADE SOME SIGNIFICANT STEPS. FURTHER QUOTING, "THIS WAY OF USING AND DEVELOPING LAND DEVISED THEM THE OPPORTUNITY TO ENJOY A TRULY UNIQUE PLACE IN THE NORTHEAST FLORIDA HISTORIC DOWNTOWN ST. AUGUSTINE, A PLACE THAT THE USE AND NEED OF A PERSONAL AUTOMOBILE IS NOT NECESSARY." I, AS AN ASIDE, MANY OF YOU KNOW THIS, FREQUENTLY WALK NINE TIMES OUT OF 10 AND I KNOW OF A PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD MEMBER WHO DOES THIS AS WELL. THE ONE AND A HALF MILES TO MY PLACE OF WORK AND BACK AND I CARRIED WHAT I NEED ON MY BACK OR I CARRY MY BIKE. I'M LUCKY. I'M VERY LUCKY, NOT EVERYBODY CAN DO THAT. BUT IT IS AN OPTION IN THIS CITY AND IT'S AN IMPORTANT OPTION THAT I THINK YOU NEED TO RETAIN. QUOTING AGAIN, "THERE'S NO OBVIOUS BENEFIT THE CITY RECEIVES BY APPROVAL OF THIS LIST OF VARIANCES AND ONLY BECOMES A BAD EXAMPLE OF WHAT PROPER UNITS CAN DO WHEN OLDER BUILDINGS ARE NOT MAINTAINED PROPERLY. INCREASING THE AMOUNT OF PARKING WITHIN DOWNTOWN WILL FURTHER DAMAGE THE CULTURAL, ECONOMIC, AND ENVIRONMENTAL SUSTAINABILITY OF THE HISTORIC DOWNTOWN. THE PRESENT REQUEST OF DEMOLISHING A BUILDING TO MAKE WAY FOR COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT IS NOT THE ISSUE AT HAND. THE TEMPORARY USE OF A PARKING FACILITY IS WHAT THE ISSUE IS. FINALLY, WHILE PROPOSED LANDSCAPING WOULD BE AN IMPROVEMENT TO THE EXISTING STATE OF THE PARKING AREA, APPROVAL OF A PARKING LOT EXPANSION ON SUCH A PROMINENT PARCEL IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE INTENT OF EXISTING CODES IN ARCHITECTURAL GUIDELINES." THANK YOU [INAUDIBLE]. >> [INAUDIBLE] VICE MAYOR [INAUDIBLE]. >> THIS IS A DIFFICULT DECISION THAT WE'RE MAKING TONIGHT. I KNOW THE PROBLEM IS MUCH BIGGER THAN THIS PARTICULAR LOT. I WAS THERE TODAY WITH THE OWNER OF THIS PROPERTY AND AS I LOOKED SOUTH, I SAW THERE'S A [INAUDIBLE] AND I SAW THE OTHER LARGE PARKING LOT BEHIND. WE NEED TO REALLY REVISIT THESE CODES AND THE BONDS TO FILL. [01:45:01] I MEAN WHAT WE ARE GETTING, I APPRECIATE MR. WEEKS TALKING ABOUT LANDSCAPING THIS AND [INAUDIBLE] WE MAKE DECISIONS AND THINGS CREEP ALONG, LIKE THE LIMIT OF 20 PARKING LOT SPACES AND IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN 20, AND NOW IT'S 25, AND NOW WE'RE ASKING YOU FOR THREE MORE, SO IT'S 28. IT DOESN'T SEEM ALL THAT MUCH AND I KNOW IF THERE IS A NEED AND IT IS A PRIVATE PARKING LOT. THERE'S A LOT OF NEEDS FOR THAT. AGAIN, WE HAVE A MOBILITY PLAN AND WE'RE TRYING TO WORK IT. I'M REALLY HAVING A DIFFICULT TIME WITH THIS PARTICULAR TASK. EACH THING DOESN'T SEEM LIKE TOO MUCH BECAUSE IT'S A PRIVATE LOT. THREE MORE PARKING PLACES, AND IN EXCHANGE WE GET A NICER LANDSCAPED PARKING LOT. BUT AGAIN, HOW LONG IS IT GOING TO LAST? THE [INAUDIBLE] HAS TO BE CONSIDERED ON ALL OF THESE PARKING LOTS. WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY, WE CAN BRING PEOPLE ALONG. NOT VERY DEEP SHOPS WOULD ALLOW PARKING BEHIND. A LOT OF SHOPS ALONG THE STREETS. JUST LOOK AT SPANISH STREETS THAT YOU WALK FROM, HYPOLYTA OFF TO THE LEFT. THAT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE, IT'S VERY BAD. I KNOW WE NEED PARKING, BUT THERE'S WAYS TO DO IT. I REALLY WOULD WANT TO SEE US TACKLE THAT PROBLEM, BUT THAT'S NOT PART OF WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT TONIGHT. I KNOW THE DISTANCE TO THE THOMPSON PAPER PARKING LOT CAN'T BE CHANGED, THAT'S PART OF THE CODE, IT SHOULD BE MORE THAN 25 FEET. HE ONLY HAS THE ALLEY, NOT THAT BOTHERED BY THAT. I'M NOT THAT BOTHERED BY MORE THAN 25 PERCENT COMPACT, THE 50 PERCENT COMPACT. IT'S A PRIVATE LOT. IF THERE'S AN ACCIDENT, THAT'S GOING TO BE ON HIM, IF THERE'S NOT ENOUGH DRIVE LINE. IT DOES LOOK LIKE IT'S GOING TO WORK, BUT IF THERE'S PROBLEMS THAT IS GOING TO BE HIS PROBLEM BECAUSE HE OWNS THE PRIVATE LOT. THEN THE USE OF THE KANSITA ALLEY TO MANEUVER OR ENTER THE PARALLEL PARKING LOT, THAT DOESN'T BOTHER ME SO MUCH. BUT IT'S HARD, THIS IS A VERY HARD PROBLEM. >> IT'S COMPLICATED. THERE'S FOUR ALLEYS TO CONSIDER. [INAUDIBLE] >>I DO THAT [INAUDIBLE]. I WENT DOWN THERE MYSELF. HE SAID IT DIDN'T GO FORWARD WITH ASSISTING HIM BECAUSE DOWN THERE RIGHT NOW IT'S WICKED. THE NETTING AND ALL THAT AND HE HAS LANDSCAPING. WHEN THEY'RE TRAVELING ON THE TRAIN, LET'S LOOK AT IT FROM THE TOURIST PERSPECTIVE, THEY RIDE ALONG THE CHARLENE AND THEY'RE COMING PAST [INAUDIBLE] AND ALL THOSE GREAT PLACES. IF THEY LOOK OVER THERE, THEY'LL SEE SOME CARS PARKED IN A NICE LANDSCAPED AREA, SO IT WON'T BREAK THEIR VISION. IF THEY'RE RIDING DOWN THERE NOW, IT DOESN'T GET TO DO THIS. THEY'RE GOING TO SEE SOME WORK CONSTRUCTION. IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE IT'S A LONG STRETCH ADDING GREEN SPACES. I KNOW THAT I'VE GOT HERE TO THE NOTATIONS ON THE FLOOR THINGS, AND PARKING IS ALL I HEARD ABOUT. IT WAS ONE OF THE TOP THINGS THAT I HEARD ABOUT WHEN I WAS CAMPAIGNING FOR OFFICE. THE NEED FOR PARKING, THE NEED FOR SAFETY, THE NEED FOR PEOPLE BEING ABLE TO FEEL SAFE FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES. HE'S OFFERING THIS PARKING FOR THESE PLACES OF BUSINESS, SO HE'S TRYING TO PROVIDE A SAFE PLACE CLOSE TO THEIR WORKPLACE, SO THAT THEY CAN COME AND GO, THEY HAVE SECURE SPACES. [INAUDIBLE] NUMBERS LIKE PARKING NUMBER FIVE, SO THEY HAVE DESIGNATED PLACES. THE PEOPLE IN THE SURROUNDING AREAS HAVE COME FORWARD THAT UTILIZE THIS PARKING LOT. IT DID START OFF WITH HIM JUST TRYING TO INCREASE IT. HE HAD SMALL LITTLE AREAS HERE AND THERE, AND THEY GOT COMBINED BECAUSE OF THE BUILDINGS BEING TAKEN AWAY, SO IT WASN'T LIKE HE JUST JUMPED INSIDE THE SPACES. [01:50:04] ONCE THAT BUILDING CAME DOWN, THERE CAME A NEED TO DO SOMETHING IN THAT SPACE. IT'S NOT LIKE HE WAS TRYING TO JUST INCREASE HIS PARKING LOT SOME [INAUDIBLE] >> THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENT. [OVERLAPPING] >> I HAD WRITTEN SOME COMMENTS TOO AND THAT WILL MAYBE CHANGE FROM THE CONVERSATION THAT WE HAD. I AGREE THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO ASSUME IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD ASSUME IS GOING TO [INAUDIBLE] IN FIVE YEARS. YOU TRUST HIS WORD, BUT SITUATIONS CHANGE, SO WHATEVER HIS WORD IS MAY NOT EVEN BE OF HELP. SO WE HAVE TO CONSIDER THIS AS SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO BE THERE FOR A LONG TIME, FOREVER. I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THAT THIS HAS HIT A BUTTON OF CHANGE BECAUSE HE'S REQUESTED A LOT OF CASES TO HIS CURRENT SITUATION. HE HAS APPROVAL FOR EIGHT OR NINE SPOTS. HE STARTED INTO 25. HE DID THAT WITH THE ADDITION OF THAT SMALL LOT BEHIND THE [INAUDIBLE]. HE REALLY HAS TWO PARKING STRUCTURES NOW, SEPARATED BY THE BUILDING THAT IS NOW GONE, SO HE'S REALLY COMBINING THREE SPACES. HE'S COMBINED HIS CURRENT PARKING LOT WITH 20 SOMETHING CARS TO THE ONE THAT HAS 17, WITH THE ONE THAT HAS EIGHT, AND HE HAS NEW LAND. I AGREE THAT YOU NEED TO STICK SYSTEM CODES. WHAT I WOULD LIKE FOR US TO CONSIDER IS, AND IT'S ONE OF THE OPTIONS, IS FOR US ASK HIM TO GO BACK AND NOT ASK FOR 28 SPOTS. FOR HIM TO KEEP THE LOT WITH THE OLD BUILDING AT 20, PLUS THE ONES THAT HE HAS CURRENTLY. THAT WILL BRING ME BACK TO THE LANDSCAPING, HE CAN HAVE HIS 20 SPOTS EXCEPT FOR THOSE RIGHT ALONG THE ALLEY THERE, AND EVEN HAS THE SPOTS. HE HAS REDUCED HIS NEED FOR SPOTS BY TEARING AND BUILDING DOWN, BECAUSE THOSE LEASES DON'T NEED THEM, THEY'LL NEED PARKING. HE'S ASKING FOR THREE MORE, WHEN IT REALLY [INAUDIBLE] BUT YOU DON'T GAIN SPOTS BECAUSE HE TORE A BUILDING AND HAS THESE. SO THAT'S ONE THING I'D LIKE PROCESSED. >> MATHIAS, WOULD YOU LIKE TO RESPOND? >> NO, I WOULD LIKE TO INTRODUCE MOTION WHENEVER YOU'RE READY FOR IT. >> OKAY. WELL, I LIKE TO SPEAK FIRST. IN LOOKING AT WHAT [INAUDIBLE] WHETHER PLANNING IS HAPPENING HERE IN A DECISION OR NOT, I DO NOT REALLY AGREE WITH HIM ON ITEMS TWO, THREE AND FOUR WHICH WERE, I BELIEVE [INAUDIBLE] THE DISTANCE BETWEEN THE PARKING LOT NEXT. I FEEL LIKE THAT WAS THEIR EXISTING. IT WAS A SINGULAR VISIT UNIT. I AM VERY CONVINCED BY HIS SESSION ABOUT THE COMPACT SPACES. I THINK THAT'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING THAT'S JUSTIFIED. I DEFINITELY FEEL LIKE THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD TAKE A DEEPER DIVE INTO. WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IT, IT'S ALMOST LIKE LONG-TERM PARKING FOR IT'S TENANTS. SO HE CAN'T CONTROL WHO'S USING CAR PARK SPACE. HE'S CORRECT ON THAT. HE'S VERY CONVINCING TO ME ON THAT. I FELT LIKE THAT WAS JUSTIFIED. ON THE PARALLEL PARKING LOT [INAUDIBLE] I HAVE TO [INAUDIBLE] FOR THAT ON IT. THAT ALSO FEELS LIKE IT'S EQUAL OR DISADVANTAGE TO ME. [INAUDIBLE] I ASSUME THAT THEY'RE CURRENTLY BEING USED FOR THAT. ACTUALLY, I MIGHT SEND YOU THE PICTURE OF THE [INAUDIBLE] I'M NOT STRUGGLING WITH THOSE SO MUCH AND PLANNING AND ZONING DECISION TO DENY. I'M STRUGGLING WITH [INAUDIBLE] JUST LIKE [INAUDIBLE] SAID. I HAVE TO GO BACK TO WHAT PLANNING ZONE SAID ABOUT BASICALLY IS THIS IN THE PUBLIC INTERESTS. IS THIS FOR THE PUBLIC GOOD? I FELT [INAUDIBLE] MADE A VERY CONVINCING ARGUMENT FOR NEEDING ADDITIONAL PARKING DOWNTOWN FOR THE PUBLIC GOOD. [01:55:06] ALL THE THINGS THAT HAD PILED ON HAS BEEN ALL DISCUSSED. ALL OF THESE PILINGS ON OVER THE YEARS HAS NOT HELPED THIS CASE WHICH HAS MADE IT MORE COMPLICATED, EVEN MORE DIFFICULT TO SWALLOW. BUT MY POSITION IS THAT I WOULD FEEL CONFIDENT IN OUR ABILITY TO TURN [INAUDIBLE] BUT THAT IS JUST ME. >> [INAUDIBLE] DEFINITELY UNDERSTAND YOUR MARKET, BUT IT ALIGNS THESE SPECIFIC POINTS. BUT I WORRY ABOUT [INAUDIBLE] AND HARDWORKING BOARD AND STAFF AND I DISAGREE. I DON'T SEE THAT THEY'VE BEEN UPDATES TO THE CASE TO THE DEGREE TO WHICH I WOULD NEED TO BE CONVINCED THAT WE ARE OVERTURNING THE DECISION OF THE PLANNING AND ZONING BOARD. >> I DIDN'T QUITE UNDERSTAND HOW TO ADD [INAUDIBLE] ADDITIONAL CREDIT MARKETS. >> ADDING TO THE DOWNTOWN WHICH IS NEEDED BECAUSE WE'VE HEARD NUMEROUS PUBLIC FIGURES TALK ABOUT NEED FOR ADDITIONAL PARKING DOWNTOWN SPACES, ESPECIALLY FOR EMPLOYEES. THIS IS THE THING THAT THEY STRUGGLE THE MOST WITH AND OUR MOBILITY PLANNING TOOK YEARS. I'VE SERVED ON PARKING AND TRAFFIC COMMITTEE FOR MANY YEARS. THAT IS ONE OF THE REASONS WE STARTED WITH [INAUDIBLE] IT'S REALLY A THING THAT WE'RE NOT ADDRESSING CONFIDENTLY. IN MY MIND, THIS IS KEEPING CARS FROM WHAT WE CALL CRUISING AROUND, LOOKING FOR SPACES. IT'S ACCOMMODATING WORKERS' CARS, AND THAT'S WHAT YOU ACHIEVE. I DO THINK THAT [INAUDIBLE] LOOKED AT OUR COMMUNITY, GREAT THING. I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT CITY MANAGER AND I TALKED ABOUT AND IT'S NOT PART OF THIS CASE, THAT IT'S PROBLEMATIC. IT'S LOOKING LIKE PARKING IS MORE VALUABLE THAN THE DEVELOPMENT. SPEAKING IN YOUR TERMS, IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT DEVELOPMENT, HOW IMPORTANT THE DEVELOPMENT THAT'S SOMETHING [INAUDIBLE] THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE SEEING, WHICH IS FASCINATING, BUT THAT'S BESIDE THE POINT. YOU'RE MAKING TO MY ARGUMENT THAT I DISAGREE WITH [INAUDIBLE] SAYING THAT I BELIEVE ADDING TO SPACES WOULD BE MORE TO LOOK GOOD, ESPECIALLY SINCE THEY'RE LONG-TERM SPACES. >> BUT THE PUBLIC BENEFIT IS OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND IN-BUILD DEVELOPMENT AND REDEVELOPMENT IS OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. I WANT A VITAL RESIDENTIAL SHOPPING, RESTAURANT IN THAT SPACE THAT LOOKS LIKE HISTORIC ST. AUGUSTINE. A PARKING LOT IS A PARKING LOT ANYWHERE YOU GO. IT MIGHT HAVE [INAUDIBLE] IT MIGHT HAVE A SPLIT RAIL AND NO LANDSCAPING RIGHT NOW. BUT NO LANDSCAPING IS NOT GOING TO MAKE A PARKING LOT INTO A STRUCTURE THAT SPEAKS TO ME OF ST. AUGUSTINE. THAT'S THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. IT'S THE HIGHER PUBLIC BENEFIT, THE LONGER [INAUDIBLE] THAT I AM TRYING TO PROTECT WITH CONFIRMING THE PZB'S DENIAL. >> WELL, TO ANSWER YOUR ORIGINAL QUESTION, I'VE SAT ON THESE BEFORE AND I'VE HEARD THE QUESTION OVER THE YEARS WITH QUESTIONNAIRES, IT IS ABOUT [INAUDIBLE]. I HAVE TO SAY THAT I THINK THAT THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT I WOULD REALLY WORRY ABOUT. WE'RE GOING TO MAKE THESE DECISIONS SITTING IN THIS SEAT THAT WE HAVE. I BELIEVE THAT YOU SHOULD ALWAYS LOOK AT IT ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS. I SEE THIS AS ONE OF THOSE CASES. I CANNOT SEE THIS AS ANYTHING ELSE. BUT THAT IS ME AND I CERTAINLY WANT THIS FOR EVERYBODY TO DEBATE, AND DURATION GOING FORWARD. >> WELL, HE'S THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY AND HE'S ALREADY SAYING, HE'S ENGAGING IN OTHER PROPERTIES, BUILDING THEM UP. [02:00:04] I DON'T THINK HE'S GOING TO OVERSTRETCH HIMSELF BY TRYING TO BUILD AT THAT PARTICULAR AREA. IN THE MEANTIME SOMETHING NEEDS TO BE DONE IS ONE, TO PUT IN THE MONEY AND THE EFFORT TO [INAUDIBLE] I HAVE A FEELING SO THAT IT DOES FIT INTO THE [INAUDIBLE] AS BEST IT CAN BE IN A VACANT LOT. IT'S MY PERSPECTIVE ON WHAT I'VE SEEN AND WHAT I'VE HEARD TONIGHT AND GOING THROUGH THIS PACKAGE, YOU GOT EMAILS THAT YOU'VE SEEN THE PICTURES. YOU HAVE TWO CHOICES AT THIS POINT. YOU CAN OVERTURN THIS AND I CAN MOVE FORWARD BY MAKING IT BETTER FOR THE VISION OF ANYONE TRAVELING DOWN THAT ROAD, OR WE CAN DENY IT AND WE JUST LEAVE IT THE WAY IT IS. >> BUT WE DON'T KNOW THAT PART [INAUDIBLE] THEY WANT I UNDERSTAND. I DON'T THINK THAT WE'VE BEEN ASSURED OF THAT [INAUDIBLE] JUST THE WAY IT IS. WHY WOULDN'T THEY LANDSCAPE IT? WE DON'T KNOW. DO NOT ASSUME. >> CAN I JUMP IN? THIS IS NOT A TAKING OF A PROPERTY. HE COULD SELL THIS TOMORROW AND WHOEVER THE DEVELOPER WOULD BE, WOULD BE CONSTRAINED BY OUR CODE AND WOULD DO INTER-DEVELOPMENT. IT WOULDN'T MAKE SENSE TO BUY THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY AND THEN KEEP IT AS A PARKING LOT IF YOU'RE GOING TO SELL. YOU'RE A WILLING SELLER AND A WILLING BUYER. >> I'M GOING TO GO AHEAD AND MAKE A MOTION. YEAH, MAKE A MOTION. [INAUDIBLE] >> POINT OF ORDER. I DID ASK TO MAKE A MOTION, PLEASE. >> OKAY THEN. >> IS THAT OKAY? >> ABSOLUTELY. >> I'M GOING TO MOVE TO DENY THE APPEAL AND CONFIRM THE PZB'S DENIAL OF VARIANCE REQUEST WHICH OCCURRED ON OCTOBER 1 OF 2022. >> I DON'T HEAR A SECOND. MOTION FAILS [INAUDIBLE] LET'S TALK ABOUT IT >> I DON'T THINK ALL OF THIS IS RELATED. [NOISE] IF WE REQUIRE HIM TO GO BACK AND SAY, "GO BACK AND COMPLY WITH THE RULES." I AGREE THE 25 FEET IS THE MIDPOINT AND IN THE 30 YEARS, IT'S LIKE WE ALMOST HAVE TO GRANDFATHER THAT LAND. THAT'S NOT SETTING A PRECEDENT. UNLESS THE PARKING LOT IT'S BEEN IN 30 YEARS AND THEN THEY CLOSE. SOMEBODY ELSE WANTS TO BUILD. I THINK THE 25 PERCENT COMPACT CARS, YOU COULD ARGUE THAT BACK AND FORTH, WHETHER THAT'S A GOOD NUMBER OR NOT IF YOU CONSIDER THE CHARGE FOR PRIVATE LOTS. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> RIGHT. [INAUDIBLE] YOU WANT TO MAKE A MOTION. >> YES, PLEASE. >> I JUST WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR THE OPTION TO REMAND BACK TO PZB IS BASED ON THE APPLICANT ASKING THE CITY COMMISSION A MODIFICATION OF WHAT WAS PRESENTED AT PZB. I'M NOT COMPLETELY CERTAIN IF THAT OCCURRED OR NOT. YOU MAY WANT TO GET CONCURRENCE FROM THE APPLICANT THAT HE IS IN AGREEMENT THAT WHAT HE'S PRESENTED IS A SORT OF A MODIFICATION THAT COULD BE REMANDED BACK TO PZB. OTHERWISE, IT'S A YES OR NO ANSWER TONIGHT. >> WE CAN'T APPROVE WITH MODIFICATION. >> YOU CAN APPROVE IT WITH THE MODIFICATION. I'M JUST NOT [OVERLAPPING] COMPLETELY CERTAIN IF THAT'S WHAT THE MODIFICATION HE'S PRESENTED. I'M NOT SURE. IT WASN'T CLEAR TO ME WHETHER HE WAS PRESENTING A SOMEWHAT MODIFIED PLAN OR NOT. YOU MAY WANT TO ASK CLARIFICATION FROM THE APPLICANT. >> I THINK WHAT WE'LL HAVE TO DO IF THERE'S SCOPE FOR THAT AMONGST COMMISSION, WE CAN INVITE MR. WEEKS TO REQUEST. >> I THINK PART OF THE PROBLEM IS AND I WILL ARGUE THIS AS SUCH, IF THIS IS GOING TO BE THE WAY IT IS AND WE DENY IT, THEN HE'S GOING TO HAVE THE 25 PARKING SLOTS [INAUDIBLE] AND THERE'S GOING TO BE A DIRT LAWN. IT WAS A GREAT ARGUMENT MADE AT THE PZB THAT OPEN MARKET IS GOING TO FORCE HIM TO SELL THAT LAND. BUT WE CAN'T COUNT ON IT. WE CAN'T MAKE A DECISION TO DENY BASED ON THE FACT THAT HE MIGHT HAVE TO SELL THAT LAND AND SOMEBODY WILL THEN COME IN AND BUILD SOMETHING. I DON'T BELIEVE WE CAN. THAT'S JUST MY PERSONAL OPINION. IT'S REALLY A CONUNDRUM TO ME TO SAY, [INAUDIBLE] TO HAVE A VACANT LOT. I DON'T THINK HE'S GOING TO LEAVE THE [INAUDIBLE] HE HAS TOO MUCH PRIDE IN THE CITY TO LEAVE THE [INAUDIBLE] HE'LL PROBABLY FIX IT OFF WITH SOMETHING. [02:05:02] I DON'T KNOW THAT, OBVIOUSLY. WE DID NOT TALK ABOUT THAT. BUT HAVING TO INCLUDE THAT NOW A VACANT LOT IN THE SAME PLAN THAT HE HAS TODAY AND IMPROVING THE LANDSCAPE, TO ME IS TO THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. TOURISTS AREN'T GOING TO CARE IF THERE'S A VACANT LOT. I'VE BEEN TO ASHEVILLE RECENTLY. THEY HAD TORN DOWN A BUILDING AND THEY HAD A CONSTRUCTION SITE THERE. THEY'LL FIGURE, OKAY, THEY'RE BUILDING SOMETHING. IT'S NOT GOING TO BE THE TOURISTS WHO ARE GOING TO BE ADVANTAGED IN EVERY LANDSCAPE. IT'S GOING TO BE ALL OF US WHO LIVE HERE AND TRAVEL DOWN THERE AND [INAUDIBLE] RESTAURANTS AND SPEND OUR TIME DOWNTOWN, AND THE RED BULLS. I'D LIKE TO SEE THAT LANDSCAPE, BUT I'D LIKE TO SEE THEM STAY WITHIN THE CODE. I'D LIKE TO SEE IT BEING USED FOR A GOOD PURPOSE. >> I'VE GOT IT. [INAUDIBLE] WOULD BE ACCEPTABLE [INAUDIBLE] BECAUSE WE'RE JUST STRETCHING THE CODE FURTHER. YOU'RE SAYING THE [INAUDIBLE] LET'S SAY THAT A PROBLEM HE HAS BUT WE'D LIKE TO SEE IT LANDSCAPED. >> ANY OTHER OPINIONS ON THAT MATTER? I'D LIKE TO ENTERTAIN THAT. >> IT'S OKAY. >> EVEN THOUGH I THINK THAT I'M HEARING YEA FROM YOU AND YEA FROM YOU, AND THAT YOU WOULD HAVE TO ASK ME, FOR ME THE ALTERNATIVE WOULD BE I'M ASSUMING [OVERLAPPING] >> TO BUILD ON WHAT HE SAID, HE SAID THE POWER WOULD BE BACK IN 20 MINUTES, HE'S NOT GOING TO GO BACKWARDS. >> NO [INAUDIBLE] BELIEVE IT, BUT I THINK IF YOU YOU BACK AND MAKE IT 1,000 QUESTION, WE JUST DENY IF WE CAN COLLECT ANYWAY, CORRECT? >> WELL, NOT WITHIN A YEAR TYPICALLY. AND I CAN HAVE OUR PLANNING DIRECTOR COME BACK UP [OVERLAPPING] AND ANSWER THAT. WE TRY TO AVOID HAVING REPETITIVE APPLICATIONS. NOW, IF THERE'S SOMEONE [OVERLAPPING] CORRECT. AM I CORRECT IN THAT? >> THAT'S CORRECT. >> ALL RIGHT. AND SO IF THERE'S MAYBE SOME MIDDLE GROUND, I'M HEARING THAT, YOU MAY WANT TO ASK THE APPLICANT IF HE'S WILLING TO MODIFY HIS APPLICATION AND BE REMANDED BACK TO PCB. >> WE'RE GOING TO DO THAT. I WILL TEST DEEP WATERS TO SEE [LAUGHTER] IF THERE IS SUPPORT FOR THAT, I GUESS. SO MR. WEEKS, WOULD YOU LIKE TO SPEAK? >> IT'S POSSIBLE IF MR. WEEKS HAS A VERY SPECIFIC MODIFICATION HE WANTS TO PRESENT, YOU COULD APPROVE A SPECIFIC MODIFICATION. I'M JUST NOT SURE WHAT THAT IS. [OVERLAPPING] RIGHT. SO YOUR CHOICES ARE IF A MODIFICATION IS PRESENTED AND IT'S CLEAR ENOUGH TO YOU THAT YOU WANT TO TAKE ACTION ON IT TONIGHT, YOU COULD DO THAT, OR YOU COULD REMAND BACK. I'M JUST NOT 100 PERCENT THAT MR. WEEKS HAS PRESENTED A MODIFICATION. >> I'M NOT EITHER. I APPRECIATE ALL THE DELIBERATION, ALL THE TIME, ALL YOUR INPUT. I DON'T DISAGREE WITH ANYTHING THAT YOU'VE SAID. I DON'T WANT THIS TO BE A PARKING LOT FOREVER. IT'S NO ADVANTAGE TO ME TO BE A PARKING LOT FOREVER. I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THE THREE ADDITIONAL SPOTS BECAUSE I'M SPENDING ABOUT $30,000 TO BEAUTIFY THIS LOT AS GOOD AS I CAN FOR SOME PERIOD OF TIME. YOU MENTIONED THAT THE BUILDING DOESN'T REQUIRE PARKING FOR THE EMPLOYEES OF THAT BUILDING, THEY HAD ONE SPOT. I'VE GOT ANOTHER BUILDING THAT I'M BUILDING IN THE COLONIAL STYLE, THOSE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO NEED TO HAVE SOME PARKING. I'D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE FREE PARKING SPACES FOR THAT BUILDING, FOR THEIR MANAGERS AND STUFF. IT'S SO IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE WHO WORK DOWNTOWN TO HAVE SOME ACCESS TO THEIR CAR BECAUSE THEY'RE IN AND OUT ALL DAY LONG. THEY'RE NOT LYING AROUND IN CIRCLES, BUT THEY HAVE TO GO TO THE BANK, THEY HAVE TO DO DIFFERENT THINGS. NOW THAT THERE'S HARDLY ANY BANKS DOWNTOWN, MONA HAS TO GO TO THE BANK FOR ME ALMOST EVERY DAY OUT ON US ONE. WHAT I'D LIKE TO SAY IS, I'D LIKE TO KEEP THE 28 SPACES. IF YOU THINK THAT THIS IS GOING TO BE SOMETHING THAT YOU'RE CONCERNED ABOUT BEING FOREVER, I WOULD PUT A 10 YEAR TIME LIMIT ON IT. THAT WOULD GIVE ME TIME TO RECOUP SOME OF THE COST OF THE LANDSCAPING IF THAT'S WHAT IT TAKES, OR BETTER YET, I'M HOPING THEM WITHIN THAT PERIOD OF TIME, THERE'S SOME ALTERNATIVES THAT THE CITY IS GOING TO PROVIDE SO THAT I DON'T HAVE TO PROVIDE PARKING FOR THESE PEOPLE, AND THAT THERE IS AN ALTERNATIVE. WHEN I STARTED THIS, I THOUGHT THERE WAS GOING TO BE A PARKING GARAGE AT THE GRACE UNITED METHODIST CHURCH, AND THERE'S NOT, BUT THERE MAY BE SOMEDAY. THERE WASN'T A PARKING GARAGE AT THE END OF CASTILLO GARAGE, BUT THERE IS NOW. [02:10:04] THERE MAY BE SOME OTHER ONES. I DON'T WANT THEM IN HP 1, 2 OR 3, BUT OUTSIDE OF THAT, I'D BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO HAVE SOME PARKING THAT EMPLOYEES COULD RENT. IF THAT'S THE CASE, I'M THE FIRST ONE TO JUMP ON THE BANDWAGON AND GET RID OF THESE PLACES. IF LONGEVITY IS A CONCERN FOREVER, BECAUSE I HEARD THAT SEVERAL TIMES, I WOULD OFFER A 10 YEAR TIME PERIOD. DURING THAT 10 YEARS, I'M SURE, I'M GOING TO DEVELOP THOSE LOTS. BECAUSE I DON'T WANT THEM THERE FOREVER. I HAVE THE PLANS, I HAVE THE VISION, AND I'M NOT PLANNING ON SELLING. BY THE WAY, I'VE WORKED 40 YEARS TO ACCUMULATE THAT VERY NICE COLLECTION OF REAL ESTATE, IS MY REAL LIFE MONOPOLY. I CHERISH IT, IT'S MY LIFE, IT'S MY LEGACY, AND I'M NOT PLAYING THEM ON SELLING IT, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO FIX IT UP. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> THANK YOU. I HOPE I ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION. I HOPE THAT OFFER HELPS MAYBE WITH SOME OF YOUR CONCERNS ABOUT FOREVER. >> MR. WEEKS, JUST TO TRY AND HELP BOTH SIDES COME TO SOME DECISION MAKING, THE CITY CANNOT ADD CONDITIONS LIKE THE 10 YEAR TO BE APPLIED. >> I UNDERSTAND THAT. >> WE UNDERSTAND THAT PART. JUST SO THE COMMISSIONERS AND YOU ARE ALL ON THE SAME PAGE, YOU ARE REQUESTING THE SAME CORE, WAS IT FOUR VARIANCES? AM I REMEMBERING RIGHT? >>THERE'S FOUR ITEMS, YES. >> FOUR ITEMS OF THE VARIANCE AS YOU PRESENTED AT PCB, CORRECT? YOU'RE NOT MODIFYING THAT? >> NO. >> YOU WERE REQUESTING IT FOR A TOTAL OF 28 SPACES, CORRECT? >> CORRECT. >> ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU. >> WE'RE BACK TO YOU. YOUR IDEA WAS A GOOD ONE AND [INAUDIBLE] THANK YOU. I THINK WE'RE BACK IN DISCUSSION AGAIN, AND WE'VE HEARD ONE MOTION AND I'M PREPARED TO MAKE ANOTHER MOTION. I MEAN, THAT WE OVERTURN PLANNING AND ZONING DECISION AND GRANT THE VARIANCES TO OUT CUT. >> I SECOND. >> ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION ABOUT [INAUDIBLE]. NOW, CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> NANCY SIKES-KLINE? >> YES. >> CYNTHIA GARRIS? >> YES. >> JAMES SPRINGFIELD? >> NO. >> BARBARA BLONDER? >> NO. >> ROXANNE HORVATH? >> NO. >> [BACKGROUND] THE MOTION HAVE FAILED, AND IF WE COULD HAVE A COUNTER MOTION SO WE CAN HAVE SOME FINDINGS IN THE ORDER, I'LL HAVE TO DRAFT. >> RIGHT. >> RIGHT. WOULD YOU LIKE TO MOVE [INAUDIBLE]? >> [OVERLAPPING] I USED EARLIER, I WOULD BE HAPPY TO. ONCE AGAIN, I MOVE TO DENY THE APPEAL AND CONFIRM THE PCBS DENIAL OF THE VARIANCE REQUEST WHICH OCCURRED ON OCTOBER 2022. [NOISE] >> SECOND. >> ALL RIGHT. ANY DISCUSSION? NOW, CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> BARBARA BLONDER? >> YES. >> JAMES SPRINGFIELD? >> YES. >> CYNTHIA GARRIS? >> NO. >> ROXANNE HORVATH? >> YES. >> NANCY SIKES-KLINE? >> YES. I KNOW. I'M SORRY. I MEANT TO SAY NO. I APOLOGIZE [LAUGHTER] SORRY. >> I'M SORRY. DID YOU CHANGE YOUR VOTE? >> I DID. >> BUT YOU INTENDED TO. WHAT WAS YOUR VOTE FOR THIS GO ROUND, I'M SORRY, BECAUSE I LITERALLY COULD NOT HEAR IT. I THOUGHT YOU SAID YES. [OVERLAPPING] >> THE MOTION WAS TO UPHOLD MY VOTE WAS TO SAY NO. THAT'S WHAT [INAUDIBLE] >>ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. >> THOSE ARE THE 3-2 VOTES? >> YES. >> OKAY. THE MOTION CARRIES? >> YES. >> OKAY. >> SORRY. IT BEEN A LONG DAY. ALL RIGHT, SO WILL MOVE ON. WE DO NOT HAVE ANY GENERAL PUBLIC CLARIFICATIONS. NO ORDINANCES. STAFF REPORT. WE HAVE ONE ITEM UNDER STAFF REPORT. [10.A. Discussion of a donation of a menorah by Rabbi Levi Vogel to be placed as part of the City's display of lights and Christmas tree during the annual Nights of Lights event in the Plaza. (D. Birchim, Assistant City Manager)] MR. [INAUDIBLE]. >> MAYOR, VICE MAYOR, AND COMMISSIONERS. MAYOR NANCY SIKES-KLINE HAS SPONSORED THE INSTALLATION OF MENORAH DONATED TO THE CITY BY RABBI LEVI VOGEL. THIS IS A HOLIDAY DECORATION NOT INTENDED TO MAKE ANY RELIGIOUS COMMENTARY. THE MENORAH IS ROUGHLY 12 FEET TALL. IT'S ILLUMINATED. IT WILL BE LOCATED IN THE PLAZA. [02:15:09] THIS IS THE PUBLIC MARKET. THIS IS WHERE THE CHRISTMAS TREE IS. BECAUSE THE MENORAH IS 12 FEET TALL AND NEEDS A ENERGY SOURCE, A POWER SOURCE, WE INTEND TO PUT IT RIGHT HERE IN THIS CORNER. I'LL SHOW YOU WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. RIGHT ABOUT THERE. YOU CAN SEE THE CHRISTMAS TREE IS ON THE RIGHT-HAND SIDE OF THE PHOTOGRAPH. THE MENORAH WILL COMPLEMENT THE CHRISTMAS TREE AND ALL THE HOLIDAY LIGHTING. ONCE AGAIN, THIS IS BEING DONATED AS A HOLIDAY DECORATION, NOT A RELIGIOUS DECORATION. I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER THE QUESTIONS YOU HAVE. >> THAT'S WONDERFUL. SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD DO EVERY YEAR. >> I AGREE AND PARTICULARLY IN LIGHT OF THE RECENT UPTICK IN ANTISEMITISM, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO BE AS WELCOMING OF EVERYBODY THAT WE CAN POSSIBLY. >> ANY OTHER COMMENTS? CAN WE GET A MOTION? I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE MENORAH DISPLAY AND [OVERLAPPING]. >> ACCEPT THE DONATION. >> ACCEPT THE DONATION. APPROVE THE DISPLAY. I GUESS THE DISPLAY COMES AFTER THE DONATION. >> I SECOND. >> ALL RIGHT, SECOND. ANY OTHER DISCUSSION. MADAM CLERK, YOU CAN CALL THE ROLL. >> NANCY SIKES-KLINE. >>YES. >> ROXANNE HORVATH. >> YES. >> CYNTHIA GARRIS. >> YES. >> JIM SPRINGFIELD. >> YES. >> BARBARA BLONDER. >> YES. >> ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU. MR. [INAUDIBLE]. ITEMS BY THE CITY ATTORNEY. >> I HAVE NOTHING AND YOU'RE PROBABLY GLAD NOT TO HEAR FROM ME ANYMORE. [LAUGHTER] >> ITEMS BY THE CITY CLERK. [12.A. Request for two appointments to the Code Enforcement Adjustment and Appeals Board (CEAAB). (D. Galambos, City Clerk)] >> GOOD EVENING, MADAM MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS. I HAVE ONE ITEM. IT'S A REQUEST FOR TWO APPOINTMENTS FOR OUR CODE ENFORCEMENT ADJUSTMENTS AND APPEALS BOARD. WE HAVE TWO TERM EXPLORATIONS, AND WE DID ADVERTISE APPROPRIATELY, AND WE RECEIVED TWO APPLICATIONS FROM MARILYN MEADE GARRETT AND MS. KAREN VALACHOVIC. BOTH OF THOSE ARE CURRENT BOARD MEMBERS AND BOTH ARE ELIGIBLE FOR REAPPOINTMENT. MY REQUEST IS TO REQUEST THAT THEY'RE REAPPOINTED. >> ALL RIGHT. >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> YES, I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE REAPPOINTMENT OF THESE TWO FINE PUBLIC SERVANTS. >> PUBLIC SECOND. MADAM CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> BARBARA BLONDER. >>YES. >> NANCY SIKES-KLINE. >> YES. >> CYNTHIA GARRIS. >> YES. >> JIM SPRINGFIELD. >>YES. >> ROXANNE HORVATH. >> YES. >> ALL RIGHT. DISTRICT MANAGER. [13. ITEMS BY CITY MANAGER] >> IT'S BEEN A QUIET DAY FOR ME AND I HAVE NOTHING OTHER THAN TO WISH EVERYONE A VERY HAPPY HOLIDAY SEASON. >> ABSOLUTELY. IT'S TIME FOR ITEMS [INAUDIBLE]. [14. ITEMS BY MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS] LET'S START WITH MR. SPRINGFIELD. >> I HAVE NONE. >> YOU HAVE NONE. COMMISSIONER [INAUDIBLE]? >> YEAH, I WANTED TO FOLLOW UP ON THE PUBLIC COMMENT AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING WHERE FOLKS WERE ASKING ME ABOUT WHAT THE PROGRESS IS ON THE LINK GETTING BUILT OUT RIGHT AFTER LINCOLN PARK. I DON'T REMEMBER THE EXACT DETAILS. >> FIGURES. >> FIGURES, THANK YOU. I'M SORRY. DO YOU HAVE THAT INFORMATION AVAILABLE? >> I THINK IT WOULD BE BEST IF WE JUST SCHEDULE A STAFF PRESENTATION FOR THE NEXT MEETING. >> THANK YOU. THERE'S SOMETHING ELSE THAT- >> DISCUSSION ABOUT THE BRIDGE, THE MAINTENANCE OF TRAFFIC. >> [INAUDIBLE] DO REROUTING. >> YEAH, THAT MIGHT BE HELPFUL TO GET A SENSE OF WHAT THE IMPACTS ARE AND WHAT THE DOT IS PLANNING TO DO TO AMELIORATE THOSE IMPACTS. >> PERHAPS WE COULD INVITE THE DOT TO DO A PRESENTATION OF THEIR MAINTENANCE AND TRAFFIC PLAN. >> I THINK THAT'S A GOOD IDEA. I THINK LOOK AT MAYBE MAKING [INAUDIBLE]. >> I KNOW THAT THEY HAVE THOROUGHLY LOOKED AT ALL OPTIONS, BUT I DON T KNOW THE DETAILS OF WHAT THEY HAVE OR HAVEN'T HELPED MUCH. I WOULD RATHER LET THEM ANSWER THAT QUESTION. >> OKAY. LASTLY, I WANT TO ECHO THE SENTIMENTS OF CITY MANAGER ABOUT THE HOLIDAY SEASON AND REALLY ASK PEOPLE TO APPRECIATE EACH OTHER. IT'S BUSY OUT THERE AND I THINK WE JUST NEED TO TAKE A MOMENT AND REFLECT ON HOW FORTUNATE SO MANY OF US ARE. [02:20:02] >> COMMISSIONER GARISS. [OVERLAPPING]. >> I DON'T HAVE ANY FURTHER COMMENT. >> HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO EVERYBODY. OKAY. WELL, I'D JUST LIKE TO THANK EVERYBODY PATIENCE TONIGHT. VERY LONG MEETING. IT WAS A DIFFICULT ONE AND I THINK IT'S [INAUDIBLE] WE HAVE THAT AT THE END, SO YES. THANK TO STAFF, THANK YOU FOR YOUR HELP, THANK YOU FOR THE FIRST MEETING AGAIN. JUST KNOW WE'LL JUST KEEP IMPROVING AND GETTING BETTER. THANK YOU AND HAPPY HOLIDAYS, EVERYONE. THIS MEETING IS ADJOURNED. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.